PCGS forum deletes member accounts

Funny how all these stories never have names behind them

 

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I didn't ask his name. He struck up a conversation with me as we watched the 1894-S Branch Mint Proof Dime being auctioned.

 

I put 0 legitimacy into random people saying things at shows. It does no one no favors to repeat something that someone you have no clue who they were said. Anyone can go to a show or auction and pretend to be a big shot

Unless of course we should believe PMs are the only real money and gold and silver can only go up in price.

 

Wrong. She admitted it. Her partner (Bruce) also confirmed that she was responsible for convincing Charville to make the changes.

 

Yes. She also said that it made grading look inconsistent and that it made it harder to convince people otherwise. Her theory was that this would restore confidence in PCGS in a couple of years. That she wants to kill transparency says a lot about her in my humble opinion.

 

That's fine. But the theory behind my brief encounter holds water whether he was lying to me or not. That being: Tightening grading standards can be good for the hobby and collectors and bad for dealers that dump lots of money into trying to score the upgrade in the resubmission game.
Additionally; deleting the excess images of upgraded coins is, in theory, financially beneficial to dealers who own and market those upgraded coins. By hiding the fact that a coin was upgraded by 1 or more grades, it gives the customer false confidence that the coin is (for example) a true MS67 rather than a previous MS66 or worse, like it was formerly. Deleting the repeat images also hides this fact from other dealers, who may buy it and sink even more money into resubmission fees, trying to get it into an MS68 holder.

 

So what if someone were hypothetically to say about your business that they like you because you know how to convince people to over spend on coins but then said they got it from a source they and have no idea who it is that said it? Would you be okay with that?

If it isn't fine for it to be done to your business, it isn't fine for you to do it to others.

All businesses yours included deserve facts and not just hearsay where some people you don't know and can't name said. There are FAR to many rumors on forums getting thrown out as facts

I've already addressed the images thing multiple times in this thread, as has PCGS on their own site. NGC does the same thing with their images keeping them hidden unless you know the cert.

It's getting really old having to repeat things over and over and over

 

Nope but nice try. She was in favor of it and unless you want to make the absurd accusation that she was the only one who was and got them to do it on her own which would just be well......

https://forums.collectors.com/discu....collectors.com/discussion/1012008/coin-facts

She doesn't need me to defend people who have a grudge against her though

 

I wouldn't say I started a rumor. I shared a short encounter with a dealer that I had 3 years ago at the Winter FUN show. He told me that. Seemed to be pretty successful at it, too. Whether anyone believes me... I don't care. I shared my observations based on that and the current grading & images situation. That's what forums are for, after all... sharing fact and opinions. Sorry if I frustrated you.

 

I give credit where credit is due:

 

My point is you just spread something you heard from someone you self admittedly didn't even know who said it.

People say crazy things all the time and not even knowing the source of a rumor is even worse to share.

I don't think you would appreciate that done against you

 

Wow.

 

So much for the act about caring so much about the hobby and collectors... all my opinion of course. She showed her true colors IMHO.

 

Jealously is always so attractive.

 

Baseball... the actual dealer who told me that was proud of his business model. Maybe I should have said that to begin with. He didn't think he was "fooling collectors," he thought he was being a smart businessman. So I'm not trash talking his business. I'm simply repeating what he was proud to have accomplished. Namely: being a successful dealer using and playing the upgrade game.

 

So which is it do you not know who they are or don't want to say?

PCGS is the one you are trashing with the hearsay

 

Like I said, I didn't get his name. It was a 3 or 4 minute conversation. Sorry if you don't believe me. Again, my point was drawn out of that encounter, as written above.


And how am I trashing PCGS? How am I trashing anybody? God himself knows that some coins that were previously in MS66 holders were inaccurately graded back then and now certainly deserve to be true MS67s. But that goes both ways. Some have no business being upgraded, IMO. (It's all subjective, though, as coin grading always has been).

 

Of course it is, which is why hearsay stories help no one and just feed into some of the conspiracies that some promote. Rational people understand grading does change over the decades and that just because something were to upgrade doesn't mean that it was graded right the first time just as things do downgrade now. The problem is that some people just try and jump on the upgrades to push what they want.

The other point was plenty of people like to act like big shots at shows and auctions and I do this or that, but if they have no proof of it it's almost always just talk. The people that can make a huge living spotting upgrade candidates don't run around talking about it

 

Yeah, but honestly I don't think I'd brag about handing the TPG'S over $100,000 of my money in 1 calendar year. Doesn't seem brag worthy... unless maybe he made $1M. But he didn't say that, of course.

Edit to add: I once spent over 5k in a calendar year between PCGS, NGC, and CAC fees (shipping included). At the end of the year I had lost financially. I felt like an idiot when I saw that number whilst doing my taxes. After that year, I got more conservative with what I submitted, and I quit trying to shoot for the big score/upgrade, and it paid off. But then again, I'm a small potatoes, vest-pocket dealer, so my experience in all this is just a drop in the ocean.

 

We are in agreement here, for sure.