Building my 12 piece US gold set in a couple weeks. Question for the experts.

I recently decided in late December that I wanted to buy some pre 1933 gold coins. I went and picked up a $10 Indian, $10 Liberty, $20 Saint Gaudens, and $20 Liberty all in MS-64-MS65 PCGS cases. Cost me about $5,000. Not bad IMO considering that is a little under 3oz of gold as well and the coins are old and beautiful. Love it and decided that I want to build the standard 12 piece type set.

I can't stand coins being slabbed, so I documented them being sealed up, receipts, photos in and out of the cases, and took them out of the cases. Personal preference. I know why some people keep them in cases, but for me I like them out and in regular air tite cases. I also buy these for myself and not for resale. Reselling them can be handled by my future children or grandchildren one day and they can deal with the hassle haha. I purely buy graded and slabbed coins because that way I should hopefully 100% know they are real, and then I can pick the condition I want. I like that. I know it's not for most, but it's how I enjoy my coins. I live on a small island in the pacific too, so coin shows and seeing things in person is just out of the question. Internet only for me.

Anyways, that leads me up to my question. With the $10 coins and especially with the $20 coins, the premiums for MS coins are barely over spot for the most part (unless you need specific dates or mints, which i have never been interested in). Well now I have made a basket online to buy the rest of the 2 $5 coins (not the classic), 2 $2.50 coins (not the classic), 3 $1 coins, and the $3 coin. Currently I have them all from MS62-MS64. Looking at $6,900 for those 8 coins. Way over spot of course.

With these small coins the markups are much more, and there are actually fairly larger differences in price from 62 to 63 and to 64. I'm asking for an opinion here. With the small coins, is it worth paying more for a nicer coin, or should I bump things down a notch in grade because they are so small? Can you really even see the difference between a 63 and a 64 with a coin that is 13mm wide? Is it as worth with the small coins even buying graded? I'm going to assume to treat them the same as the larger coins, but I'm having a hard time here justifying over $2,000 for one coin over that same coin less than $1000 for AU. Bumping things down 1 or 2 grades could put me at $4,000 instead of $7,000 you know?

I think I know the answer here will be to go big or go home, and I'd love to have an all MS graded set (I know not still in the cases). But just looking for opinions. I do well, but I'm no multi millionaire. Money still does matter. No pre 1834 coins for me! I'm not even going to consider trying to get into those.

Thanks for the help.

 

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For the smaller gold sticking with graded ones is even more important as they have a lot of VERY good fakes in those series.

As far as what grade you should go for that is entirely up to you. The worst thing you could do would be to buy some, crack them out, and then decide that you aren't happy with them and they aren't good enough.

Since you are planning on cracking them out though you could consider looking at AU 58 coins, but you're the only one who can decide what grade will make you the happiest.

 

The main difference with the smaller gold coins as they ride up the MS ladder is their luster (of course other factors come into play as well). Larger gold coins for obvious reasons take on a lot more contact marks so an MS62 $20 coin may look beat to hell compared to an MS62 $2.50 liberty head. If luster isn't a huge deal for you and surface preservation ranks higher up then definitely save the money. For me personally luster is everything and I don't regret paying a premium to find lustrous gold coins in my set.

By the way I appreciate the way you collect. Even if you hate slabs you at least appreciate they have benefit for you with the added security spending thousands of dollars from images alone. People have posted threads with multiple fake coins listed and their response was they hate TPGs. So they chose the lesser of two evils - buying fakes instead of buying certified coins and just cracking them out after.

 

If you are planning on keeping the coins until your descendants inherit them, swallow your dislike of plastic and keep them in slabs unless you are buying grades with values close to melt. Your descendants may not know how to handle or value raw coins. Easy to imagine them taking $1000s of dollars away by harsh handling or cleaning. If they live in a remote place, it will be much easier for them to sell the coins in slabs ... just consign them to a major auction company. No hassle. Just call'em up, tell'em what you've got, and they'll tell you how to ship the coins.

Neat collecting goal. Should be an interesting and pretty collection when complete.

Cal

 

Like he says he is buying them for himself and he enjoys them more out of the slabs. Costing heirs a few dollars potentially isn't going to make or break anything.

 

Some can, but can you? Looking at the coins themselves (ignore the holders for the time being), do you see an appreciable difference? If you do, does the increase in quality justify the increase in price? If not, then go with the lower grade.

Focusing on the coin instead of the holder will allow you to find premium/undergraded coins for good prices. Ignoring the coin puts you at risk of buying an overgraded coin that would be very tough to recoup cost down the road.

Since you are cracking the coins out, I would suggest buying AU examples for coins which have huge premiums in the MS grades. Some raw storage methods could damage the surface of the coin resulting in a downgrade. The TPGs can be inconsistent, so you risk a downgrade when you resubmit the coins before you resell them. Don’t try selling the coins raw because no one will give you serious money for them. The slabs justify the price, which puts raw coins at a huge disadvantage.

The smaller coins are faked much more often, so you are better off buying them already certified.

Check out AU-58’s and compare them to MS-62/63’s. Pick whichever maximizes the quality-to-price ratio. My points above about cracking out still apply.

Between MS-64 and MS-68, there is a very noticable difference in quality. MS-62/63/64 is less noticable. Usually, the only real difference between adjacent numbers in this range is price. Be picky and find quality specimens in the lower grades that look just as nice if not nicer than the higher grades. They are out there, but you will have to put in effort to search and learn.

 

To add on @baseball21 I also highlly recommend getting certified ones. For the $2.5 gold and $5 pieces, there are fakes for almost every single year and mintmark. Some are even 90% pure gold and will fool most dealers.

Here are 2 that I own. Only one is genuine, though both are 90% pure (the fake is actually 91.3 percent pure, and is not simply plated). Both were scanned on a Fischerscope Xan machine. Both are also 4.18 grams which is the correct weight.

Which is the fake?

 

I'm REALLY going to be disappointed if the 1926 (left) is not the fake.

 

Me too

 

Lots of knowledge here guys. Thank you.

 

Popular Numismatists claim that gold has been pretty strong in 2018 compared to the rest of the bear market.

 

The 1915 piece is genuine. Notice the 1926 example has no designer initials above the third number of the date, which for many is the first clue.

The mystery is why fake a date (1926) that is not rare? Henning faked nickels because I feel it was a trial run to eventually move on to higher denominations made of silver but he would use nickel.

Again, it is 91.3% pure gold - not plated. I heard many were faked in this manner in Lebanon, but not sure why. Anyone have an answer?

 

Potentially because gold was illegal to own unless it was a collectible piece at one point in time. So people would counterfeit collectible gold just to be able to keep the gold content for themselves.

 

The '26.

 

I the prices I'm mentioning pretty standard?

 

If you like raw coins, study the coins until you feel confident buying them raw, and just buy them raw. You can get them in better grades, and then just pay a nominal amount to get them slabbed/authenticated. If they come back as fake, you have a basis to return the coin. Cracking them out is the same as throwing away money. My two cents.

As for the grade, with smaller gold coins a 60/61 is almost always a dog unless it's prooflike. 62 is a decent looking coin. Not much improvement for a 63. 64 is a bit nicer, but still not worth much of a premium above a 62 in my opinion. You get the big jump in quality with a 65 because you get the real booming luster.

 

Order placed. I figure what the heck?! Instead of sweating over $2000-$3000 over the total set, I just went ahead with the MS62-65 coins. Complete set with have cost me about $12,000. Not cheap, but I'm happy. I just want a nice looking set, and one day when I have kids and grandkids they can have it and enjoy it or sell it. I'm super excited! So much history, and 4oz of gold in the set is still nice to have. Thanks everyone!

Now that i have the set, I'll just start buying a $20 or $10 gold every month.

 

You have a better budget than me

 

Just some advice from a similar practitioner of your final observation, you may, and probably will, really come to appreciate the variations in grading if you buy graded coins.

You can eventually over the years be able to locate the undergraded coins. If the coins are left in their holders, they generally will become a real treasure to enjoy, for both you and others.

The $20s can be a "real deal" in todays market, once you learn to properly determine "value".

JMHO

 

Thanks. yea i can't stand the holders. they will be cracked out as soon as I get them and put in other cases. Just personal preference.