GTG: 1983-P Washington Quarter

So, is 83P considered the "key date" for clad Washingtons? With a mintage of 673 million, why is this one considered "scarce"?

 

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Because unlike most other clad coins, there are no Mint Sets in 82 and 83 and therefore no ready supply of 1982 and 1983 coins in fresh uncirculated condition. The intervening 30 years has seen most of these coins sent to their actual purpose, making change for a dollar.

Scarce, but only in high end uncirculated condition

 

This type of coin is one of the reasons I wanted to learn to grade MS coins... because just as cherry-picking for error or varieties is fun and possibly profitable, being able to know the difference in MS 64-65-66-67 can also make a world of difference in a coin like this. Conditional rarity based on various extraneous factors. Can be worth a bit of $$$ with the right coins.

In fact, I recently went through my hoard of modern clads and culled out the ones I now recognized as being lowly MS 61-64's, as none of most of the years have any that would probably be worth saving for even another 10 years. I expect in another couple years I will go through what I have and really pare down my 'collection'.

 

I'd guess there aren't even 100,000 in uncirculated condition.

All of the '82 and '83 issues are tough except the cents and even these can be pretty tough in Gem.

Most of the clad is poorly struck by worn dies and all marked up. AU's are more common for these dates but even the AU's tend to look bad.

 

I guess its a matter of perspective..... when you say there may not be 100k in UNC, I look at that and say it is a downright common coin.

 

But that is in all grades. Including AU-63

 

NGC pop report: 0/4/9/12/59/591/347/8 (MS60-67) - 1049 total graded
PCGS " " : 2/9/43/107/305/676(16)/339(39)/20 - 1625 total graded
Note: for PCGS in parenthesis, those are the plus grades
so total of this for the two major tpgs: (if my math is right)
2/13/52/119/364/1283/725/28

None have graded MS68 or higher, the most have been MS65 or below. I don't know what to expect in the future,but I would suspect (unless someone is hiding a number that are high grade, that could 'flood' this later) that if only 100,000 uncirculated ones are available and less than 3000 have been graded, with only 28 of those getting MS 67 and 39 getting MS66+, so far, that we might be looking at a total of 150 that are of 'superior' grade, compared to the rest. And possibly one to 10 in the future may grade MS67+ or MS68. Perhaps there may only be another 5000 graded in the future and few of those getting high grades.

 

Yes, but if you look a little bit more.... 1983P has *significantly* more coins graded than any other date surrounding it. It has *significantly* more 66's than any other date for years around it. Very few dates actually have 68's until you get into the mid-90's.

So, what actually makes this date so special, except for hype?

 

I have only seen one that would grade at a 66 or better. And I gave it back to a friend that asked me to look thru a jar of coinage he stashed in the attic. Most of these coins were pumped back into circulation not kept.
I wonder if he still has it? Put it into a 2*2 flip for him.

 

Physics,

I searched a long time for a quality uncirculated raw 83P. In the end, I never located one with even a remotely decent strike. Anyone not familiar with this series would look at your typical MS63 and think the TPG's entirely mis-graded an AU coin. Quality was that bad. I can only speak from my experiences but do feel this is a very tough coin. Will try to post mine shortly.

 

True. It has a lot more graded and think it us primarily because of the 'hype'....

but the hype for this (and the 1982 also) is based not just on, say 100,000 now in uncirculated, but these were years that the uncirculated basically weren't saved. Supposedly because of the economic conditions at the time, these quarters were released into circulation and they heavily circulated. Since they were not great strikes, few were saved or kept. It seemed like it would not be worth saving the ones that were appearing in change. No mint sets that year. And people did not appreciate saving relatively weak quarters. I think by the time they realized it, most had been 'gone' from good possibilities. Just like any other year or years where none were saved (predominantly) and the opposite of the years many were saved... which devalues them.

 

What I meant was not even 100,000 were set aside.

Attrition on these hasn't been so staggering as the attrition on most moderns but is still substantial. A lot of dealers will tell heirs who bring clad into the shop to just spend it. Others are lost in disasters.

This is hardly a "rare" coin in BU but many of the older coins that have big price tags are more common. And unlike the older coins which are often collected in grades down to Fair most clad is collected only in BU or down to nice XF.

But the biggest thing is that there are huge numbers of Gem and high end BU collections of clad quarters. In this case I mean there are several of thousands of them but this date (and others) are actually much scarcer than the number of collectors.

These coins tend toward the awful. I have far more experience with the '82-P which is different than (but comparable to) the '83-P so will speak to it instead. This coin was very poorly struck. I've seen examples from every single die and only a very few ever could have made a nice coin because they were aligned poorly and set at too low of pressure. Then these dies were overused extensively. The coins were usually scratched in the coin handling equipment.

Nobody cared about collecting clad in those days and the mint didn't care what they looked like so most looked like junk. Since nobody cared nobody set aside any of this junk anyway. Most of what survived, survived "accidently" or in mint sets made to fill a very unsophisticated demand.

It was exceedingly difficult to find nicely made coin back in those days and '82 and '83 were worse.

WashQuartJesse shows a spectacularly made coin above but I'd guess there weren't even ten or twenty of this quality that survive today if the picture is indicative of true appearance. I'm not sure there is a single '82-P that I'd grade a true Gem (MS-65). Sure the services grade many poorly made coins at this level but it doesn't change the fact that even nice MS-64's are rare for the '82-P.

I expect demand to continue to creep higher for clads and for the collections for which they are demanded to continue to grow and improve. I don't know how a demand for tens of thousands of coins where the supply is essentially "zero" to not have an effect on price and the ability to locate choice specimens.

I don't really have any nice '83-P's despite advertising to pay $40 @ all through the '80's and '90's. I never got lucky. I did get lucky with the even scarcer '82-P and was able to set several aside. Just like with varieties, if you could find one nice gemmy coin there would be others with it.

 

The services routinely grade poorly struck specimens from worn out dies as "Gem". There might not be a single true "Gem" '82-P and I'd be surprised if there are even 20 for the '83-P. I'm guessing the '83-P is more common in Gem because I've seen so many that are well struck from good dies in circulation and in rolls and sets. The trick with this date is to find coins that aren't badly marked. About 5% of '83-P dies made good coins for the first (up to) 50,000 strikes but only about 2% of '82-P dies did. This is a lot of coins but take it from somebody who spent a lot of time trying to intercept them before they got into circulation: It was like looking for a needle in a haystack.