Buyer's of mint products ? Worth reading

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hahah GD you are so funny I hope this drives home the point that buy coins from the mint for collecting not for profit hopefully if people follow this they wont get burned

 

I can't see the link. Can you repost it in plain text?
Thanks.

 

The modern coins are only worth buying when they sell below melt value. Amazingly [or maybe not] this happens occasionally, especially for the coins minted in the 1980s.

Good article.

 

That was a good article. When I buy from the mint it is just for collecting. I expect that after I am gone(hopefully a long time from now) that my heirs will make a little money. On some I am sure they will lose money, but oh well.

 

I remember you mentioned this sometime last year and afterwards I started picking up some US 1980's commemorative silver on eBay for right around melt value- always meant to thank you for the tip since besides the fact that it was cheap I really like many of the designs (especially 1984 Olympic dollars).

 

That was a good article, very true. Thanks for posting GD. :thumb: A lot of these moderns are going to drop a bit soon IMO. Doesn't make them bad to collect, but I wouldn't buy one just to make a profit. Or any coin for that matter. Collect what you like, and if you make a profit, then look at it as a bonus IMO. JMO, and very debatable, I know. My opinion is worth exactly what you paid for it. Thanks again for posting it GD.

Phoenix

 

I like them too. They are far too common to ever command much of a premium over melt value, but the commems from the 80s are a far better deal and just as good looking as the later coins which are also too numerous to ever be worth the prices paid for them. The 2001 American Buffalo is the poster-child for an overpriced coin [in my opinion]. I also particularly like the gold commems from the 80s.

 

I will never take a loss on a coin. I will also never make a profit. To do either one, you must sell your coins and I simply have no intention to do that.

BTW... I buy what I buy because I like them. If my heirs can sell any or all for a buck or two, good for them! I'll be dead, and past caring. LOL

 

/amen

 

GD; I've always bought coins from the mint not for profit but for pleasure. I've never preassured myself with the fear of buying hoping that the item which I bought would go up in pice. This takes all of the fun out of collecting. I've never bought a certified coin and don't intend to....I buy because I like the look of the coin, design, quality of strike, etc. etc. I don't always agree with the philosophy and hair splitting of the 3rd party grading services but I know there are folks out there who must have the best quality and the only way they can have it (in there way of thinking) is to go 3rd party. If i'm happy with the way the coin looks it's good enough for me and the profit I take is the happiness and relaxed pleasure received every time I examine a paticularly loved piece in my collection.
Hope I haven't offended anyone with my opinion on 3rd party grading...I know a lot of folks depend on it to sell and buy unseen products.

Ken

 

After all, how long will it be before we have a grader of the grader of the graders?

After reading that article I thought the best part was the above statement. I too am getting tired of all the new graders, coin books, coin web sites, coins on TV and I even get offers with my credit card statements for coins. Next I'll be seeing McDonalds with a Burger, coke and rare coins.

 

I used to buy at least a few sets of Silver Proofs every year - sometimes more. One for me and the rest to sell.

Well, 1999 and 2001 stayed strong. Others tanked to the point where I recently posted a thread about 2003 sets being worth more as "junk silver" than dealer bid.

My mint purchases since 2006 have been ZERO. My money is going back into my type and odd denomination coins for two reasons.

They tend to at least "hold" value and I like them more.

Good article.

 

I like some of the modern commems, I buy them. If they go up in value enough I will sell them, if they don't I will enjoy them. Buying in bulk to sell to rubes is not my idea of playing in the coin market. Most of the junk out of the mint, is mostly just that.

 

I have been buying all the 2000 and 2003 silver set that I can been picking them up at shows for 18 to 20 each not a bad price. 2003 last year where no siver quarter sets were made

Dept of Treasury Mint sent me a letter asking to do there survey. They said only 20 min. bull more like an hour + . I was aleast able to vent

 

Well GDJMSP, the first thing that I thought of when I saw your post and responses thereto was how it was odd that you was not getting your throat stomped on by those in the community that religiously preach: “I do not collect for profit, I collect for pleasure.” Maybe that Admin title stopped that usual knee jerk reaction, because I have seen it, and I am sure everyone else has seen it happen as well.
Now moving on to the subject of the article, I have to disagree with the body of the article. Let us look at what the author is saying.

First of all, he contents that instead of buying current modern U.S. Mint products, you should be buying Saint-Gaudens Double Eagles. But in doing so, he quickly admits that there are dates out there that have “...literally tens of thousands of coins certify to high grades.” He then culls down the field even farther by stating “If at a particular grade of Saint-Gaudens 2,000 or more coins are certified to that grade or higher, that date in that grade is likely to behave as a bullion coin with a small numismatic premium; it will go up and down with the price of gold – melt value plus a small premium.” (emphasis marks are mine.) So taking this example, we are to determine that to qualify as true numismatic worthy coin, it has to have a population of under 2,000 pieces. How many collectors are there in the world today? Estimates range from 100,000 to over 2,000,000. Regardless of what number you are comfortable with, of those collectors what percentage of them are able to afford a 1907 High Relief Saint-Guadens double eagle? Two percent? Three percent? How about a 1932 Saint-Gaudens, currently listed in MS-65 at $140,000? Provided of course that one even comes up for sale. A half percent? Less?

The author continues to support his supposition by comparing the Saint-Gaudens to the current First Spouse gold coins. He claims that there are 40,000 MS-69&70 and PF-69&70 coins being minted. Having one means you are just part of a 40,000 member club. Because all the coins are ultra high grade, maybe in 100 years (and several thousand being melted down during this time for bullion value), maybe then you will have a coin worthy of numismatic value. But don't hold your breath.

The authors own argument falls apart when he then compares the value of a 1915 Saint-Gaudens double eagle (Accepted as a numismatic rare coin and of numismatic value.) By the authors own admission, after holding this coin for over 93 years (lets see, how many generations is that...4?) it currently is only $200 over melt. Anyone with a bit of economic knowledge knows that the “rule of 72” beats that by several factors. See here: Wikipedia on Rule of 72

So let us look at some modern U.S. Mint products and see what they have done. I start with the one probably everyone is most aware of, the 1996 W Proof American Silver Eagle.

Offered only with the complete American Eagle gold set, it was just kind of tossed in there. In fact, there was no price difference between the 4 gold coin set and the 5 coin set. Both were offered at $999.00 Today, 13 years later, the W Silver dollar alone is fetching prices of $10,000 if you happen to come upon one that someone is willing to part with. That is 1,000 percent profit in just 13 years, from ONE coin of the set. That blows away the “rule of 72” by mega factors.

Ok, that was an easy one. How about the 1999 Silver Proof set? Originally offered at $31.95 now selling for $370 a set. That is 1,158 percent profit in just 9 years. And my last example is the 2004 uncirculated mint set, twenty-two pieces sold for $16.95 – now retails at $75.00. A 443 percent profit in three years.

My point is this, profit can be made from all aspects of collecting. But without hindsight, it is damn tough to know just which of the modern products will increase in value. Will the U.S. Marine commem continue to hold its value in 10 years? 20 years? Who knows. But right now it is a hot item in the commem market due to current world conditions.

Collect what you want for whatever reason you want. I enjoy collecting for the history and for the beauty. I am also one who freely admits that I collect with the intent of making a profit in several years to help fund my retirement. I make no bones about that. Would I like to own a 1917 High Relief Saint-Gaudens double eagle? You bet! But I would rather own a 1995 W American Silver eagle for profit sake. hya:

 

edited - copyright law

Ruben, and everyone else - please don't do that ! It is against the law. I posted a plain text version of the link for dreamer, which is what he asked for.

 

Collect Rare Coins if Looking for a Profit
By J. Esposito
January 17, 2008
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I'm surprised it does not say:goofer:

I sell Rare Coins if Looking for a Profit
By J. Esposito
January 17, 2008
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:goofer:

 

Thanks GD. Very interesting article.