A recent Coin World article made me ponder this thought, now I will see if I can put it effectively into words. I am posting it here because of the depth of numismatic knowledge we have here. I would love to hear what anyone who has a definate opinion thinks. One coin of each current denomination was struck and placed into a casket in the cornerstone of the 2nd San Francisco Mint. The building's location is unknown as is the location of the one time cornerstone, but witnesses verify that they were indeed placed there. In 1907, an article announcing the discovery of some rare coins including an 1870-S 3 dollar gold piece (a piece supposedly unique to the cornerstone) was published and since the coin has resided in both the Eliasberg and Bass collections. Here is my theory: At some point before 1907, the cornerstone was either burglarized, discovered or in some way compromised (you choose how you want to put it) and the coins made their way into private hands. Many other theories exist. The Coin World article states that the man who coined the piece for the cornerstone actually minted two and sent the other piece off to his niece. I believe this to be the generally accepted theory, but I am curious as to why the original cornerstone has NEVER been found and why not only has this supposedly unique piece, but others eventually surfaced? Is it so incredible that the cornerstone coins are not there anymore? Is it impossible that the coins entered the general public's possession through less than honest means? Why is this particular theory NOT the one that immediately comes to mind when the actual location of the cornerstone has been unknown for longer than the possession of the coins has been public? I would like any and ALL opinions. This is conjecture corner, no idea too ridiculous! Please tell me what YOU all think.
I do believe that the reason your theory is not given consideration is because the cornerstone is still there. They just don't know exactly which stone it is. Or, they're not telling. By the way, coins from such entombments in other cornerstones in other buildings have been removed, some recently. And the coins were a mess, corroded and greatly deteriorated. So even if someone were to remove the coins from the S.F. Mint cornerstone - they wouldn't get much.
but if they removed them some 20 years or less after they were laid there???? This is kind of the crux of what I am saying. They may have been removed only a few years later. No one knows for sure where the cornerstone is, and if they did steal them from it, hiding it's whereabouts would then become an advantage. I am trying NOT to build a huge conspiracy theory here, but more a simple someone took them scenario.
You do realize that you would have to destroy the building to get the cornerstone out ?? And since it was a US Mint - that would have been rather difficult. You couldn't get to within 50 ft. of the building.
The cornerstones on old buildings, were usually massive things, not something that you could get into easily, not to mention the cornerstone of a federal building that was in the business of processing gold and silver. That building would have been well guarded, and not something that someone could get to easily
if so, then where is it? The building's location that is... have they ever found where the building is? (maybe I am off my nut but I thought that they were unable to locate where the building was exactly.) And whether or not that is true, remember this is San Francisco where there was a MASSIVE earthquake in 1906 (1 year before the article and "public discovery" of the coins) isn't it possible that the cornerstone may have been lost or destroyed then?
The second SF mint is still in use today. There have only been two there. As for removing a cornerstone, it would be almost impossible, as the building is made from huge granite blocks. Even if the coins were there, with the environment in the bay area, I'm sure they are little more than rust spots now. Guy~
Maybe what you are referring to is the old Moffat & Company building that the mint took over before the first mint was built. I suppose it could be considered the first mint in SF, but I doubt the US Mint put any coins in cornerstones, as the building had already been there for years. The next two mints still remain intact today. It could be possible Moffat $ Co places coins (they would be gold) in a cornerstone. To the best of my knowledge, that building no longer exists. But, I have heard the story you are asking about. It would be interesting if someone could dig up some more info on this. Guy~
Not neccesarily. Things were much different then. In fact, right up until the assassination of president Garfield (as I recall), you could walk right up to the president, in the white house, and shake his hand.
Yeah ya could, but not at the US Mint. The mint was the storehouse for the nations gold & silver supply. Getting to the building was tougher than getting to Fort Knox today.
And it is probably a very good theory considering the one 70-S 3 dollar gold known today has initials scratched in it and at one time it had a loop soldered to it for use as a watch fob. Hardly something you would do with rare coins that you had gone to great risk to steal from the cornerstone of a government building. It also makes sense in another way. If you were producing coins to place in the cornerstone you wouldn't have a problem coming up with nice examples of the coins already being made for circulation, but what about those coins which were NOT being made? Getting the dies wouldn't be hard, just have them shipped from Philadelphia. After all that is where all of your dies come from. (Of course there can be some problems with that as well. The gold dollar and 3 dollar dies arrived without the mintmark on them.) Then how do you strike them? Put the dies in the press and try and turn the press on and off again so as to try and strike a single coin? What if it doesn't look good, try again? More sensible would be to turn the press on and let it run a few cycles producing from two to a dozen coins and then you have a group from which you can select the coin you want. This would explain why there are two half dimes (one cornerstone in in collectors hands) two 3 dollar golds (one cornerstone, one in collectors hands), and 10 silver dollars. (Possibly they started with the dollars and found the didn't have to run the press quite as many cycles so they cut back on the 3 dollar and half dime.) This would also mean that there is probably still an 1870-S quarter out there waiting to be discovered. Most people tend to think that the cornerstone would be in a corner of the building, and you see a lot of buildings with a fancy stone with the date on it in the corner of modern buildings. But a ceremonial cornerstone can be placed ANYWHERE in a building. (The cornerstone of the second Philadelphia mint was "placed" a couple weeks before they even began the foundations. there was no corner to put it in. The ceremony was held but I believe the cornerstone items were taken back to the first mint and actually placed in the final cornerstone later.) So the SF cornerstone could be anywhere, in a wall, under the foundation, under the floor. I believe the mint had later additions put on it as well. The cornerstone could be hidden behind on of these additions as well and be inaccessible. As mentioned the 2nd SF mint is still in existence today. Typically cornerstones of old buildings are found and opened when a building is demolished. This hasn't happened with the old mint and until it does we may never know the truth about the cornerstone. The old SF mint was one of the few building to survive the 1906 quake and subsequent fire relatively unscathed. I think that is a bit of an exaggeration, but you would not be able to go around unescorted, there would be some areas you would NOT be allowed to go into, and I do think they would object if you started trying to knock a hole in the wall.
Thank you everyone for straightening me out on this one! The info I had always gotten was kind of piecemeal, and as you saw, I knew very little when it came down to it. But that's why I LOVE this forum!!! Great info, and great people!!! Thanks again!!!
Good discussion. I believe the mint in question is the big rascal that's still standing and that survived the quake in 1906. In this case, the corner stone would still be in place. On a related note, the quake that occurred in 1906 essentially destroyed the city (actually, the mint was one of the few buildings spared). Looking at some of the barber S mint prices for the years 1901, 02, 03, 04 and 05 there are some real rarities and yet I believe their mintages were decent. Check dimes, for instance. I wonder how many bank rolls of S mint early 1900's coinage are still buried in The City. Think of businesses that buy rolls of change for commerce and have it in their small safes or cash registers. Not knowing, just pondering, rono
