ANACS vs NGC

Actually, no, it doesn't. Coins are not graded across series, but rather each date and mintmark combination is graded against itself only.

 

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That's what I was trying to say. FWIW, grading the Norweb/ANA 1913 Liberty Nickel a PF53 is some kind of joke. It's in the 40's max. Point is, it's the worst one of the 5.

 

Right, but the TPG grades it according to it's value. Why? If you grade it PF40, it's still the worst, but the grade is accurate.

 

Most have, some have changed as standards and grading changed but its not like every coin graded in the 80s or 90s upgraded. Valuation plays a much smaller role than is being assumed in this thread at this point. It's just the subjective part, a grade bump for wild colors or a 64 being a 63 because of a small issue and a huge value jump at 64. It's no where near the value of the grade changing every time the market does

 

That seems like an elegant solution for Zincolns. Perhaps one could find a slab composition that would disintegrate at the same rate as the coin itself.

 

It's simply the attempt (at this atypical extreme) to answer the question, "How much less should I expect to pay for this one compared to the other 4?"

Ever notice how many ultra-rarities HAVE official grades from major TPGS but are displayed outside the slab? Hmm. Guess it really is all about "trust issues" after all. "Those crooks at the Smithsonian switched these!"

"Yes, this 1933 Double Eagle belongs over in the other gallery."

 

But that's the inherent problem. Over time what you should pay will change and in proportion to the rest, that may change as well.

 

mikenoodle, posted: "Quit trying to bring value into a grading equation. That's the variable that is completely screwing up the whole deal."

Amen! The folks in my grading class figured this out in the 1970's when our assignment was to design the perfect grading system!

Now, for those of you who are thick-headed, stuck in your ways, never had an original thought or buy the "commercial Kool-Aid"... the operative word here is: "Variable."

And this folks is why grading has become so complicated and run by the boys with connections and deep pockets. They don't want a simple grading system. Let's introduce as many variables as we can to describe a coin's condition, than add the need to know how rare it is, the conditions it was struck under, and finally the biggest screw the pooch of all - its value for the specific date and mint!

That's why two coins of the same type in the exact same condition of preservation or amount of mirror reflectivity will be graded differently because one of the identical coins (with a different date and mint) is scarcer in that condition and worth more money than the other.

That's why the owner of a large west coast firm was quoted as saying something like: "Any coin worth sending in for grading is worth sending more than once." That's why coins that were formerly graded AU decades ago are now graded MS (because the experts at the TPGS claim their grading has evolved as they became more knowledgeable about how to grade). PHOOEY!

Way to go Mike! Unfortunately, the damage to a perfectly simple grading system was done long ago and can never be fixed.

 

Mike, I love your show and my friends love your show. Please keep the new episodes coming. Who cares if some guys who learned how to grade in 1965 don't like it. The fact they don't like it should tell you that you are doing a good job.

 

Thanks for the kind words.

Don't be hard on @Insider, I really believe that he is well intentioned, but just tends to rub against the grain a bit more than most.

As for the show, we do it because we want to create something that is fun and hopefully brings the hobby to a previously untapped younger audience by using a podcast format. We hope to help by growing the hobby for future generations.

 

Some years ago ICG was grading a lot of high end unc coins as MS70.
So many that it in fact tarnished their reputation, to the extent that
ICG meant “it could go 70!” Yes determining if a coin is ms or pr 70 should
be easy. If you see the tiniest tick or nick or flaw it aint no 70.

 

Just a simple question: Are you "okay with" an AU58 coin having a higher market value than an MS60 coin, of the same issue (type/date/mintmark)? I'm not. But if you insist on a strictly technical system, this is exactly what you'll have.

 

Yes, I am. If an AU-58 coin is spectacular in eye appeal and the MS-60 coin is dull and lifeless, yes! the AU coin is more desirable and therefore SHOULD demand a higher price.

Also remember the MS-60 coin will be heavily bag marked or have other detracting blemishes, where the AU-58 coin should have little to no contact marks.

 

Okay, good for you, but this has been determined by the "powers that be" to be the unacceptable part.

 

The problem is that the "powers that be" have a vested interest in making grading complicated and unclear.

There are many times I have chosen a coin that grades AU-58 over one that graded MS-63.

How many times have you yourself said, Kurt. "Buy the coin, not the slab."

 

Absolutely. Most 58s would be a 63 or better if it wasn't for some slight rub

 

Just a simple answer: I don't care what a person's asking price is, what the coin actually sells for, what the price guide says it's worth, etc. All I care about is that it is always graded the same by a knowledgeable, experienced person - forever - as long as its condition of preservation stays constant. History has proved this is not the case! This dream may come true far in the future when computer imaging is universal.

Therefore, if most collectors/dealers/professional graders would rather have a beautiful slider than a baggy original Unc and will pay more money for it - I don't care.

The only thing that matters to me is whoever (me included) buys a coin knows what he/she is buying and can make an informed opinion on its true condition and value whether it is raw or slabbed. That comes with education.

 

I agree that if the main function of a TPG is to protect the uninformed, then we really don't need them.

 

As soon as I see even one value guide acknowledge that AU58 even COULD CONCEIVABLY BE worth more than a MS60, I'll buy in. Not until then.

 

I just want equal grading standards across the board.