eBay counterfeit coins and lack of response to reports

Has anyone else noticed that eBay has been completly unwilling to address the counterfeit coins being listed? I've reported roughly 1 dozen differnt coins over the past week and eBay refuses to remove the listings, claiming it doesn't violate their policies.

Some of the coins I've reported recently:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/405275588169
https://www.ebay.com/itm/395726709483 (sold after multiple reports...)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/126693055149 (sold)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/387444516585 (sold)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/387444519601 (sold)
https://www.ebay.com/itm/387444515709 (sold)

 

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Here's another one:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/186723004803

 

The solution is to not use FleaBay. They don’t care and you don’t matter…Spark

 

I have stopped reporting listings because nine times out of ten, they found "nothing wrong with the listing." While I hate our sue happy world, I do hope eventually eBay gets sued on something that makes them look closer at all the scams and fakes. The fakes, the damaged "error" coins, and the "No Mint Mark" junk that get listed constantly gets under my skin. I would love to meet the individual who started the "In Cod We Trust" nonsense.....

 

Obvious fakes, problem is feebay only cares about making money and over the years they've gotten worse!

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/405275588169 the reverse type on that 1894 dime didn't exist until 1901. I mean, other than the fact that it's blatantly counterfeit on appearance alone. I've given up reporting them. Knowingly facilitating the sale of counterfeit coins is illegal, but until ebay gets prosecuted for it nothing will change. Money is their only objective, and I don't even look there anymore. The scammers can play among themselves.

 

One of the issues with this, is should eBay just listen to random people? Are you a world renowned expert that even eBay would have to recognize?

Believe it or not, eBay has many categories of items, besides US coins, that it allows sellers to list. In a perfect world, eBay would hire hundreds of experts to vet all these different categories. With the addition of this army of experts, how would you like to pay those new eBay fees?

 

My understanding is that they used to have a qualified team, they may have even been volunteers, who at least vetted the reports of counterfeits, and then ebay killed it off. I'm not giving them the excuse that they're saving sellers money on fees. I can more reasonably assume that they were losing money on sales to unwitting customers. I can tell them that the 1894 dime above is an impossible coin until I'm blue in the face and they'll still leave it up. Whenever I've reported in the past, I tell them very specific things that prove the coin is counterfeit. If they had anyone worth a grain of salt, that person (or even AI?) would recognize that I know what I'm talking about. They simply don't care.

 

No, I certainly am not. However, I am more than competent. Further, I have given eBay images highlighting the issues with the coin, and images to the real coin from PCGS Coin Facts (telling them where I got the images). They simply do not care. As further evidence of that, one of the listings I reported to them specifically stated it was a "base medal coin" and "not silver". The seller clearly knew it was a counterfeit coin. Their listing was not 100% deceitful, regardless, selling the coin in the US is illegal. eBay still refused to take it down... Finally, I am quite certain that I was not the only person reporting those coins. Sure, perhaps I was one of a few. Perhaps I was the first. There is no way I was the only person...

They certainly do have a lot of categories. While I cannot speak to those, I can speak to US coins. There are specific statutes dealing with the sale of counterfeit coins. While I will freely admit I am not an attorney, I believe the law is fairly clear and eBay is likely opening themselves up to potential legal issues by failing to adequately police the listings on their site.

While it may seem (or so it seems) absurd to you that eBay has responsibilities here, they do. Businesses in many industries have faced legal consequences for failing to ensure illegal activities were not facilitated by their site/business. eBay is certainly not immune.

 

When I spoke with one of their CS agents, they claimed they still have a dedicated team. Personally I do not believe it, or if they do they have no training or knowledge of coins. But, they did claim to still have it.. I hope to find out soon. I've reached out to their corporate office and will continue to escalate until I get some sort of response.

 

Thanks. What a bunch of bunk if that's ebay's position. If they are completely hands-off and merely facilitating a transaction, buyer beware, see no evil hear no evil - then why is there a Report button with a specific counterfeit criteria? Why are there written policies prohibiting counterfeit coins? They know it's a violation of the law to knowingly facilitate the sale of counterfeit numismatic items. They're just covering their you-know-whats in case someone decides to enforce the law. "See? It's against our policy. But we don't have the resources to enforce our policies because we fired them all." Total crock.

 

A tale of 2 horses: one named “Trust” and one named “Care”.

@jmon …I applaud your tenacity and fervor, but I fear you are beating 2 dead horses.

I’m sticking around to see if you have any success…Spark

 

While I appreciate his opinion about that position being legally defensible, there are many people and companies that would prove that stance false. One of the memorable instances to me was backpage. The site was taken down and seized by the government because sex trafficking was occurring there. Following that the CEO was charged and prosecuted. While, I believe, he did eventually prevail on the sex trafficking charges, he did end up in prison and the site was taken down. There are many differences here, and I'm certainly not accusing eBay of sex trafficking, but... they have a legal quagmire IMO.

18 U.S. Code § 485 - Coins or bars:

Whoever falsely makes, forges, or counterfeits any coin or bar in resemblance or similitude of any coin of a denomination higher than 5 cents or any gold or silver bar coined or stamped at any mint or assay office of the United States, or in resemblance or similitude of any foreign gold or silver coin current in the United States or in actual use and circulation as money within the United States; or​

Whoever passes, utters, publishes, sells, possesses, or brings into the United States any false, forged, or counterfeit coin or bar, knowing the same to be false, forged, or counterfeit, with intent to defraud any body politic or corporate, or any person, or attempts the commission of any offense described in this paragraph—

Shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than fifteen years, or both.​

Now, is eBay dealing in these counterfeits? They could argue they're not. But, at a minimum, they are knowingly facilitating the sell of them provided it can be proven they were given notice of the counterfeits.

I also believe eBay may be liable under 15 U.S. Code § 2101

(b) - Coins and other numismatic items.
The manufacture in the United States, or the importation into the United States, for introduction into or distribution in commerce, or the sale in commerce of any imitation numismatic item which is not plainly and permanently marked “copy”, is unlawful and is an unfair or deceptive act or practice in commerce under the Federal Trade Commission Act [15 U.S.C. 41 et seq.].

and:


(d)Provision of assistance or support
It shall be a violation of subsection (a) or (b) for a person to provide substantial assistance or support to any manufacturer, importer, or seller if that person knows or should have known that the manufacturer, importer, or seller is engaged in any act or practice that violates subsection (a) or (b).
​

Again, I am not an attorney so may be incorrect in my assumptions here. However, I have seen many instances in my years where a person or business was prosecuted because they knew, or should have known, something was illegal. They may not have been the sole actor, and may have played nothing more than a supporting role, but they were still prosecuted... eBay, here, in my opinion, is begging for a legal smackdown if they do not take substantial action to curtail and dissuade the sale of counterfeit coins (or any counterfeits) on their platforms. Claiming it was too expensive, they didn't know, etc., is only going to provide so much cover.

 

I wish that would work... I know my business profits would skyrocket if I could claim I couldn't afford to comply with any number of the countless regulations business face today...

 

Thanks. It may be a dead horse... but, I'm either too stupid or too stubborn to care.

 

Yes they did. They also had a specific link for reporting questionable coins that included a text box that allowed you up to 10,000 characters to specifically describe exactly what the problems were. That link then took your report directly to that team. Back when it was active I managed to have several auctions ended for counterfeits. And usually it was fast, the auction being pulled in less than 3 hours.

 

That character limit speaks volumes, doesn't it. Give us as little information as possible so we can pretend we looked into it.

 

You need to have a "special" person that you can contact to report items and usually EBay listens to and acts on their requests. We, from the Canadian numismatic community, have 3 people who can tell them and they report it .. then, almost immediately it is removed. Many of the moderators of the coin sites have an "in" with Ebay to report fakes. Sometimes, just telling the seller his item is a fake and that you are reporting it to EBay is enough to have them remove it. As long as there are dishonest dealers, it's an unforgiving task to make them stop.