NGC Registry - important changes

As many of you know, I am an avid collector of US coins and I am currently ranked #62 in the "Basic US type set + gold (7070)" ranking. I wasn't really surprised about this announcement, but still wanted to share it and see what my CT buddies think about it:

https://www.ngccoin.com/news/article/5627/NGC-Registry/

In a nutshell: PCGS is out
"Starting in January 2017, if you would like to add a new coin to an NGC Registry set, it will need to be an NGC-certified coin."

 

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Not unexpected as you say considering PCGS has always allowed only PCGS slabs on theirs. I always thought more of NGC, viewing them as more mature than PCGS for their more reasonable position.

 

Shoot. Maybe now I'll need to start collecting coins instead of holders.

 

I would say that should have happened a long time ago ! since grading standards very from one company to the next sometimes on a wild level, keeping everything in the same family just makes sense.

 

+1


It's a PITA to me. As the saying goes, I buy the coin and not the holder, and NGC slabs have plenty of well graded coins (of which I feel ZERO need to reslab them in PCGS plastic).

I don't significantly use the PCGS Registry specifically because they don't accept NGC coins. All of my coins are on the NGC Registry, and of those roughly 2/3 are in PCGS slabs.

ARGGGHHHHH!!!

 

I think I am about 50/50. I was running an NGC set (34-58) and a PCGS set while the rest of my sets are mixed. I am not sure where I go from here.

 

I agree.

Their business model, though, kind of demands it. Short of modern ASE's and the like, there is a finite population of coins to be slabbed. Once they are all affectively slabbed, what will drive volume? Lowering grading parameters. You get more crackouts if now you have the possibility of a bump in the grade. Once this has gone on for a period of time, someone will want to reset the whole thing with a new, "harsher" grading scale and all coins will all have to come back again to get the new slab and grade.

To say their grades will be perfect and unchangeable is effectively dooming the business model. However, they could never ADMIT this, because that ALSO would doom their business model.

Hate to be a cynic, but the old truism "follow the money" is still very much true.

 

You can say the same on the currency side Both PCGS and PMG both tops in the game however it has been my experience through cross grading between the two
That PMG has a stricter grading policy so allowing another TPG in to your house does not make for good business.

 

Well personally I prefer NGC slabs over PCGS . That said over the years I have used both grading services . I can understand why they are doing this......and feel bad for those of the collectors it does affect . Personally again Anacs works for me....price wise as well as their service.
Once in a slab it doesn't matter as if I choose to sell it the buyer can do as they please.
How many times have we discussed here any given grading company has messed up on a grade?
Long and short we're playing by their rules...... and they are laughing all the way to the bank.

 

I'm not disagreeing with what you have said, Doug, but do you and I interpret the first sentence in the same way? It is possible that their grading can remain accurate and consistent through the years while still changing with the times. What say you?

Chris

 

Full disclosure: Although there are faster and less expensive TPGS with accurate grading and better customer service than NGC or PCGS; I rate NGC overall #1.

If NGC wishes to imply by this letter (true or not) that PCGS grading has gone to hell, so be it. The fact that they are grandfathering PCGS slabs is a "class" act. The Registry is their baby and they can do anything they wish. I should have kicked the PCGS snobs out of the Registry long ago for not including NGC slabs.

IMO, the grading standards have "evolved as they like to say" AT EVERY TPGS over the past decades. That is an observable, not worth discussing fact and anyone who disagrees is IGNORANT. A STANDARD should not change; otherwise it is not a standard. Perhaps the NGC team is evolving slower than the rest and are trying to hold to their older "standards."

Is it possible that a TPGS can remain accurate and consistent through the years while still changing with the times? Yes and No. During specific periods of time a particular company's grading is relatively CONSISTANT. That is the job of a finalizer. Monitor the graders, teach them, and take them to the woodshed when necessary. The finalizer holds the line. When grading in the marketplace "evolves," the TPGS is forced to change. PROVABLE FACT: Major changes have taken place over the decades. Minor changes go on during market swings.

At any period of time, from what I observe, there are examples of over-graded, under-graded, and correctly graded coins from every major TPGS. IMO, most are correctly graded and the under-graded coins are "fixed."

So far, I have not personally observed any major changes to the PCGS standards but Mark sees more examples than I ever will. Time will tell if this move is strictly a business practice or the result of actual PCGS grading practice. One thing is for certain, grading will continue to "evolve" in some way (decimals, 100 pt. system, attributes like strike, surface, etc. - the old technical system, etc). That's all I'm posting for now...

 

So, if you have some PCGS-graded coins that you want in the NGC registry, better do it now. There are probably a few collectors who were planning on filling holes in their NGC registry set with PCGS coins that they were hoping to buy in 2017 ... say at the January Heritage auction. They're out of luck. I don't fault NGC for making the change, but think they should have given an earlier warning .. at least one year.

There are also some folks that have partially completed sets with a mix of NGC and PCGS coins. They'll be faced with the decision of finishing the set with NGC coins; or filling the holes with PCGS coins, buying PCGS replacements for the NGC coins (if they won't cross), and going with the PCGS registry. There may be a short-term spike in cross-over grading in both services as collectors decide to go with one or the other registry.

For example, I have a couple of early half eagle sets in the NGC registry. Each has two PCGS coins and one NGC coin. However, there are a lot of slots left to fill. I'll go with the PCGS registry because the sets are already 2/3's PCGS. If the NGC's won't cross, I'll sell them. The holes would all have to be filled with PCGS coins.

Things that weren't clear in Mark's letter is whether non-NGC coins that are already in "My Collection" can be moved into a competitive or custom set after Jan 1; or whether non-NGC coins in one set can be moved into another after Jan 1.

Cal

 

It's mentioned that they'll "provide more details soon", so I guess we'll still have to wait a couple of days/weeks for an answer.

I somehow agree that NGC is the most consistent grading company, as there are less problem coins with a clean grade or "dogs" in NGC plastic compared to the other TPGs.

 

IMO, slabbing was a detriment to this hobby. Too much faith and reliance is put into the TPGs (though their authenticity guarantee is the only plus), and market-graded coins allowed investors to pop in and drive up prices to silly levels. The introduction of the Registry Sets just exponentiated the problem.

 

I'm extremely disappointed by this decision. I have sent NGC an email requesting they terminate my membership and give me a refund.

I have been an active participant in the Registry for 10 years, and I have thoroughly enjoyed it. I liked the NGC registry because they accepted both PCGS and NGC without the pretensious air of superiority and exclusivity. Now, they are essentially no better than PCGS. There's a reason I don't participate with PCGS. And there's a reason I won't participate any further with the NGC registry.

It would be really nice if someone else developed an independent registry website, with friendly competition and the ability to easily post and share your collections. A well built, easy to use, friendly site that welcomed PCGS, NGC, and maybe a couple other top TPGs would easily gain support.

 

I think we can all agree there are + and - points to be made about TPG.

However, while you are certainly entitled to a personal opinion, as a nineteen year old collector (if I read your age correctly), born a decade after the two "big" major TPGS were around, IMO you are not qualified to determine if slabbing is a detriment or not to the hobby. You were not around.

Fortunately, by the quality of your posts, you came out OK.

 

Come on, keep your 7070 PL set, Jason. It's just a business decision, I don't think they really feel "superior"... I am looking up to your set by the way, it's awesome! Almost all your coins are graded by NGC so why do you care so much about it?

 

Fair enough... I have, however, been collecting long enough to see a severe drop in grading strictness, a greatly-increased dependence on the TPGs for the average collector (many refuse to learn to grade coins because they can pay someone else to do it. This takes a lot away from the hobby), and increased investor mentality and presence drive the prices up.

 

So true. However, in the old days it was murder out there for the ignorant collector. Dealers built houses on their backs.