Need help, denarius of Roscius Fabatus

Looking through hundreds of entries at acsearch and elsewhere, I can't seem to find a match for this variety. What are the controls in the left fields? Is the one on the reverse a rat? I can't make out the blob on the obverse at all - my wife said it was something naughty. I need help from you RR gurus...

 

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

Looks like rat or mouse, but I'm baffled by the obverse mark. What a beautiful coin however. I would love to have one like it and be trying to figure it out for myself.

 

I had to rough Andy Singer up for it but now it's mine, not for long I suspect.

 

Hmm... Crawford lists 242 control mark pairs for this issue! (Plates XVIII-LXIX) and many of the descriptions are blank or have question marks. Browsing the list, one intriguing pair lists "bagpipes" as the reverse control mark. Bagpipes?! Oh those poor Romans! I didn't know they had to suffer that "musical" instrument . Anyway, it looks like almost any object you can think of made its way onto these coins.

The reverse control mark on your coin looks like a helmet with a thingy sticking up. From the tables, possible obverse control marks include:

30. Cuirass/Helmet
45. Helmet/Helmet
192. Shield/Helmet
235. Shield/Helmet
238. Helmet/Helmet

Many entries on are simply ?/? or [object]/?, so for your coin there may be obverse options other than cuirass, helmet, or shield. And, I may be wrong about the reverse mark being a helmet.

How's that for a non-answer?

 

Thanks TIF. That's as close as I got, which at least tells me I'm not missing something obvious.

 

I think they encountered representatives from the Republic of Texas... that is an Armadillo!

 

Wow, I hadn't really taken a look at this issue before. The array of control marks is fascinating! Check out this pair: a lottery machine / lottery ball!

https://www.cngcoins.com/Coin.aspx?CoinID=40433


L. Roscius Fabatus. 59 BC. AR Serrate Denarius (3.92 gm). Head of Juno Sospita right, wearing goat's skin; lottery machine behind / Female standing right feeding serpent; lottery ball behind. Crawford 412/1 (symbols 103); Sydenham 915; Roscia 3. Choice EF. ($750)

The symbols on this particular issue of L. Roscius Fabatus depict components of an ancient lottery system. While Crawford misdescribed these symbols as a well and an unknown symbol, their actual identification is possible by comparison with contorniates made hundreds of years later which depict the identical equipment (see, e.g., Alföldi 203). Furthermore, it may be deduced through the comparisons with the contorniates that the lottery system they were parts of related to the determination of the starting positions in a chariot race.

 

I think I found it! On the Crawford table, #215 (second pair from the right):



which is described as: ? / ?

Maybe you can start a contest; most likely (or most creative) explanation wins the coin

 

Mouse and mousetrap (where's the cheese?). You have my address. Cooler coin does creativity make.

 

I'm going to go with

Aaaaand we have a winner, but I'm not giving coins away today. This is why I'm a maverick tycoon coin dealer and TIF isn't.

 

AFAIK, Andy has gone to the big temple in the sky a long time ago so you must have had this for a very long time.

@Big Money (wife) says it is a rat (head, body and tail).

I say it is a pomegranate. Stem, fruit, and leaves.

 

The reports of his death are greatly exaggerated? You must be thinking of someone else. Aside from a slight cough he seemed in pretty good health yesterday - for a dead guy, lol.

 

... FAIL

 

I thought it was something naught also.

hey wait, seriously isn't there a control mark that's a ...uh...castrated bull....uh...you know.....

could it be that??

 

Must be different Andy Singer. Andy was at the big shows in the 1980's; "running with" others like Brian Kritt, Ed Waddell, Lew Birkler, George Beach, Chris Blum, and Vick England.

 

The shape on the obverse reminds me of the dolphin shape on some RR coins. Although, if it were a dolphin it had a few too many fish and put on a couple extra pounds.

 

Tough one. I check Crawford, Babelon, and Hersh's symbol study. I believe Hersh thought the reverse was a leaf, but he wasn't able to identify the obverse. I couldn't find one in CRRO. So I guess I'm saying dunno.

 

ROMAN REPUBLIC => L. Roscius Fabatus
AR (Silver) Serratus Denarius
Rome Mint Struck 59 BC
Diameter: 18mm
Weight: 3.84 grams
Obverse: Head of Juno Sospita in goat skin, L ROSCI below, Rhyton behind (couple of banker's marks)
Reverse: Girl standing right feeding serpent before, symbol to left, FABATI in exergue

 

You can add "control marks Crawford 110, rhyton/shallow cup" to your attribution. Figures you bought one with drinking symbols

 

Same one, I spent more at his table than anywhere else. He still favors medievals but has more ancients now than before. All those listed except Lew Birkler were there but Victor England was only there Thursday, I was told, walking the floor. What was missing was the under 60 y.o. dealer group that will take over the spaces now filled by older people. More than one is over 80. I do not know how they do it. Attending the show wears me out.