The problem with 'silvered'

More coins from my latest group.

I have a real passion for Constantinian bronzes but I have very little for the silvered examples.

I much prefer a well toned bronze example.

 

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I agree. I know people pay extra for those with traces of silvering, but I think the ones with nice brown and green patinas usually look better than the blotchy silvered coins. The only time I could say a silvered one is better would be if near 100% of the silvering was intact, and if any imperfection was away from the portrait /reverse design.

 

I think the problem with silvered is the potential for coin doctors to apply a modern silvering.

I've been studying Constantine's reign intensively the last couple weeks and I'm happy this thread came up. Now I get to post my silvered coin from the era!


Constantius II, AD 337-361.
Æ Follis, 4g, 19mm, 12h; Cyzicus mint, 325-326.
Obv.: FL IVL CONSTANTIVS NOB C; Laureate, draped, cuirassed bust left.
Rev.: PROVIDEN-TIA CAESS; Campgate, two turrets, no doors, star above, eight stone layers // SMKS dot

 

I read somewhere that the "silvering" was actually tin.

 

I like both, some bronzes have great looks to them and some silvered bronzes look great, especially if the silvering is toned in some form.

I have a few silvered dogs but it doesn't bother me.

 

(Edit: Sorry, I didn't want to 'hi-jack' the thread, so I started another.)

 

Billon would still apply to the description of this coin. Billon simply means the mix has more base metals than precious, nothing more. So, both descriptions are true and accurate, though I do think silvered is a better way to describe these coins.

 

I have several silvered coins which not only look splotchy, but are very hard to photgraph. I much prefer those without silvering and with a nice hard brown patina (my opinion).

CONSTANTINE II
AE Follis
OBVERSE: CONSTANTINVS IVN NOB C, laureate head right
REVERSE: PROVIDENTIAE CAESS, campgate with two turrets, star above, eSIS(double crescent) in ex.
Struck at Siscia 328-29 AD
2.9g, 20mm
RIC VII 216

 

I have a silvered Probus antoninianus. The bronze is showing through on the high points.

I also have a silvered Gordian IV antoninianus that had a contemporary hole in it. It got put on a necklace and has since been ruined.

 

I am sad to admit that I prefer silvered coins that have lost all their silver, too, but I feel guilty penalizing a coin for being closer to original and rewarding coin doctors who clean off the sliver and retone the bronze look to my tastes. I do not apply the term billon to coins with as little silver as we see in the Constantinian period but the decline was not abrupt enough that you can draw a meaningful line between the end of billon and the start of AE.

Also for the record: I really wish those ancient Greeks had not painted their white stone art in garish colors but that does not mean I believe the traces of paint remaining on a few should be removed or restored to full beauty by their definitions. If the city of Athens decided to 'restore' the Parthenon to its full original appearance, what would be the effect on tourism? I trust they are smart enough to leave well enough alone.
http://io9.gizmodo.com/5616498/ultraviolet-light-reveals-how-ancient-greek-statues-really-looked

 

I don't like it when traces of silver remain but the underlying bronze develops a patina. It just doesn't have the eye-appeal of one uniformly silvered or uniformly coated with a patina.



Bleh!!

 

My lady has a thick/dusty looking patina, which has no bronze disease, but underneath is alot of silvering.


Æ(S) Antoninianus
O: SEVERINA AVG, Diademed and draped bust right on a crescent.
R: PROVIDEN DEOR, Fides standing right holding two standards, facing Sol standing left holding globe in left and raising right, UXXT in ex.
Ticinum mint
22mm
3.5g
RIC 9

This coin may have been issued in connection with the introduction of the Sun Cult by Aurelian as the primary religion of the empire and Severina's appointment as its priestess.

 

I like this Silvered Antonius

 

I wonder what the average Roman in the streets or in the marketplace thought about "silvered" coinage.

 

After a while you get used to it. If you are there in the year 300AD, and there hasn't been good silver around for 40+ years, you make due with what you have. Unfortunately the debasement of the currency brought about huge inflation, but if people in countries like Vietnam and Venezuela can deal with triple digit inflation today, and find a way to go about their daily lives, I suspect the Romans found a way to do the same.

 

I really wonder if the silvering was something the Roman government actively told people they were doing or if they just started doing it quietly hoping most people didn't notice that the silver content was declining further. I'm imagining a guy who just got paid with some early silvered issues trying to buy something, the merchant noticing a little bronze peaking through on the high points, and angrily accusing the guy of trying to pass off a fourrée.

 

@kevin McGonigal
I akin it to modern coinage today over the last 50 years. I remember in the US where we dropped silver coinage from 90% to clad (Halves were 40% for a few years). Prez Johnson threatened that they would FLOOD the market with clad so that the lack of silver would have no impact. Everyone hoarded them anyway, and silver jumped. As for the coinage... I feel it is like paper money: it is FIAT, and "represents" a value that is disassociated from the underlying metal value. Do I like that? No. Is it reality? Yes. Further, still: today most transactions are by plastic card or online finger typing... moving ELECTRONS around as a transaction. No underlying ANYTHING of value, rather it is FIAT or faith that you believe you got some money. Do I like it? Yeah, kinda cool. You believe my money is good!

 

Yes, I, too, wondered about that. Already as an avid coin collector I expected resistance, even shock, at the obviously reckless decision to abandon a precious metal for a base one. I thought people would recall what debasement did to the Roman economy. Imagine my shock when the next morning the sun rose as normal. Of course I grabbed (hoarded) ever silver coin that came across my palm but in the end it did not matter as the whole of it was stolen in a house break in 19771. I guess the US Treasury Department found out about my hoard.

 

OH NO! How terrible! Ugh, really sorry for that.

 

Ya, theft is a real bummer.