What sort of coins were used in Ostrogothic and Vandal kingdoms

Do we know what sort of (copper) coins circulated in Ostrogothic Kingdom (493 to 553) and Vandal Kingdom (435 to 534)?

Did Byzantine coins minted in the name of Anastasius, Justin I and Justinian circulated in those two kingdoms?

You probably know that Zeno sort of gave permission to Theodoric to take Italy, and the latter nominally accepted the Roman (Byzantine) emperor in Constantinople. So, something is telling me that coins minted in Constantinople must have been in circulation in Italy prior the conquest of Justinian.

So, do any of you know with certainty what sort of (copper) coins circulated in the those two aforementioned kingdoms before the conquest of Justinian?

When the population in Ostrogothic Kingdom and Vandal Kingdom bought bread or vegatable, what sort of coins did they use?

 

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This might be of some use to get you started on some more research
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/ostrogothic_kigdom-1.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/kingdom_vandal-1.html

 

I see.

So with other words: Byzantne coins minted in Constantinople did NOT circulate in the those two aforementioned kingdoms.

But otherwise those two aforementioned kingdoms did struck own copper coins in the name of a Roman/Byzantine emperor.

 

Actually, both of those kingdoms led the evolution of copper coinage in this period. They invented 40 and 42 unit coins long before Anastasius reformed Byzantine coinage. The Byzantines simply saw what these two groups did, its effectiveness and efficiency, and simply copied it for the new 40 denomination, which had a symbol M that us Byzantine collectors have come to love. Understanding Ostrogothic and Vandalic coinage in the 5th century is important for anyone studying Byzantine coinage.

 

Fascinating.

One more thing in case any of you know the answer: According to David Sear the copper coins of the Byzantine Empire tended to circulate for around 100 years.

But in those 42 nummis' of Ostrogothic Kingdom you can see coins from the era of Titus and Vespasian(!) - Did the coins of Titus and Vespasian circulate for 400-500 years? Or were they found in hoard on earth and then resused after the countermark? - I am very sure it is the latter, but I want to hear from you if you know the answer.

 

I have always heard any old large copper they could find they simply countermarked for new circulation at the new tariffed rate. No copper could survive circulation that long, so I am certain they didn't. I have never seen coin hoards from the 4th century containing them, so that would indicate to me they were found coins that were put back into circulation at the new value, or coins not circulating because they had a metal value above face value put back into circulation after the owners received new face value.

 

When I was in grad school, I took some classics courses just for fun (it wasn't exactly my field). One day I'm having a chat with my esteemed professor and I used "Vandals" as an example of a particularly violent and rapacious breed. (After all we still use the word today as a sort of shorthand.)

He took extreme exception to that characterization and I said no more as I knew approximately nothing. Though if I'd thought better at the time I would have remembered the "Attila the Hun" show from Flying Circus which mentioned Visigoths in this connection. We take our education wherever we can!

Now what's the point of this long story? To ask my colleagues here what would be the best example, aside from the Huns themselves?

 

here are some of my Ostrogoth coins



Theoderic. Æ Decanummium Converted to Weight (17mm 2.9 gm). Municipal issue. Ravenna mint. Struck A.D. 493-518. FELIX RAVENNA; Draped bust of Ravenna right, wearing mural crown / [Ravenna monogram in wreath; X (mark of value) at point of wreath ties]. COI 78a; MEC 145-9. converted to a two tremissis weight with the reverse removed and blank surface inscribed IS (16) in series of points to denote weight.






Athalaric. A.D. 526- 534 Æ Decanummium (18mm 2.1gm) Rome mint. INVICTA ROMA, helmeted and cuirassed bust of Roma right. D N ATHALRICVS S-C, Athalaric in military attire, standing right and holding spear, X (mark of value) in field. COI 85; MIB 77; MEC 132.





Ostrogoths, Municipal Coinage Æ 40 Nummi. Rome, AD 526-534. INVICTA ROMA, draped bust of Roma to right, wearing crested helmet, pendant earring and necklace / She-wolf standing to left, head turned back to watch the two infants Romulus and Remus suckling; XL (mark of value) above, •||||• in exergue. MEC 1, 93-5. 13.39g, 25mm, 1h.






Ostrogoths, Pseudo-Autonomous Æ Nummus (24mm 11.3g 12h). Struck during the reigns of Theodoric and Athalaric in Rome, circa AD 493-553. INVICTA ROMA, helmeted bust of Roma right / Eagle with raised wings standing left, head right; XL upwards to left; •Δ• in exergue. COI 76b; MEC 101; BMC Vandals 14; MIB I 74a; Demo 42.





OSTROGOTHS. A.D. 493- 553. 20 Nummi or Half Follis (23x24mm 6.5gm) Municipal issue. Rome mint. INVICTA ROMA, helmeted and draped bust of Roma right. REV: Palm tree; to left and right, eagle standing outward, heads facing inward; in ex. •XX•. COI 83 (Athalaric); MEC 110.




Ostrogoths, Witigis Æ 10 Nummi. Ravenna, AD 536-539. INVICTA ROMA, helmeted bust of Roma right of fine style / DN-VVIT-ICES-REX within wreath terminating in X. Metlich 92; BMC Vandals 11-3; Demo 223-5; Ladich p. 89, 18-19. 4.63g, 15mm, 6h.





OSTROGOTHS. Baduila/ Totila (541-552). Decanummium (16mm 5.1g). Rome.
Obv: DN BADVILA REX. Helmeted and cuirassed bust facing.
Rev: FLOREAS SEMPER. King standing right with shield and spear.
Metlich 98b; MEC 162.

 

Scythians or Mongols maybe? Remember though, what the west refers to as "The Huns" were the Black Huns, the weakest amongst the Black, Red, and White Huns, ( how history describes them, not a comment on skin color). The Black Huns were forced to move the furthest, the Red next, and the White the least, showing relative strength of the groups. The White Huns were only ever defeated by the combined arms and two front war with the Persians and the new tribe coming from Central Asia, the Turks.

 

Thanks for the response. In the interim I got to reading Britannica and was shocked by the amount of tribute Attila was able to extract from Constantinople. The larger amount here is on the order of $200 million! That's a lot of gold.

 

Tiny Vandalic coin :