Help! At coin show

That makes things somewhat more complicated, but as with any set all depends on your personal wants and abilities. Doing an MS short set or extended short set isn't out of the question for most, especially if a long term goal, but the entire set, well, is for many and simply because of cost. Anyway, some things you need to decide, and only you can answer, is what you like and can afford. With this particular design, examples in X range may not appeal to one guy but are adored by another, so no one is going to be able to answer certain things for you. Same thing with cost and what you're willing to invest over the long haul to make this a reality.

If you want to go the Dansco route, are you willing to buy slabbed and crack the coin out, or will you focus only on purchasing already raw? The former is one thing, but the later is going to, if a quality set is your goal, require you to learn and become deeply familiar with the series. Are you willing to invest the time and effort necessary into doing so? If not, other than buying slabbed (which must be understood is no guarantee of high quality), perhaps it is worth searching out a knowledgeable dealer willing to work with you. Depending on your desired grade range/ranges, a good number of the needed coins may be available raw and a dealer, who has access to more coins than the average collector, with a trained eye, may very well be able to offer you "value" beyond any additional cost you may incur by chosing to do business with him. The point is that deciding to move forward with putting such a set together is a very personal decision, and one that deserves to be taken very seriously. If you haven't yet done so, take some time to become more familar with the series and try to decide what grade ranges appeal most to you, then invest some more time into finding out how much such a set would likely cost you to put together today, both low range and high (this can obviously change over time, but will still give a good idea of what you're looking at in the long run). Then sit on everything for a while and make sure this is really what you want. Unfortunately, most newer collectors experience a taste change after entering into the hobby, so you want to be sure this is really where your passion is before dumping the necessary money into it. Little is less fun than falling out of love with a certain type and having to liquidate, probably at a loss, all of your first/past loves because something else now catches your eye. All just food for thought, of course...

 

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Thanks for the insight. I will take the time to think about it. The full set does look tough. Probably wouldn't be able to tackle the early dates for awhile. I will take the time to learn to grade and watch for cleaned coins. I have some friends at my coin club that helped me a lot with grading in just my first meeting. I would like to take the courses too.

 

38d might be key, but conditional rarities are more expensive even in lower grades like the 1921 p, d, s and the 1916 s, d , 1917 obverse d, s mint mark issues. The set is wonderful to acquire, just know if you are an average Joe like me, it will take time to complete but is totally obtainable. I am doing the early yrs 1916-1940 in VF or better as I already have a short set in ms65 (1941-1947). To each his own, but I think VF leaves alot of detail to be seen on this series and gives it that older look as well

 

IMO, you should not buy coins (unless they are slabbed by a major grading service) until you learn to grade. Less chance for monetary loss. However, if you must; take along some printouts from PCGS and NGC grading sites. They may help.

Get a receipt with the grade and a guarantee of authenticity. Good Luck.

 

If my math is correct, a short set of 41-47 would consist of 21 coins. I see them all the time in PGCS/NGC slabs in MS grades.

 

Just 20, not to shabby if you were just taking a stab at it!

 

Lol. I assumed all three Mints for seven years. Obviously I don't collect them (at least yet. But I will get around to it. Too lovely a coin not to.)

 

That's great! New collectors taking the time to learn, or being willing to pay someone else to do it for them, seem to be in the minority these days, so good for you. One doesn't need to actually own coins to partake in or enjoy this hobby, so there's no rush whatsoever to jump in to the actual purchasing/collecting aspects, especially when it comes to more costly material. If sitting on the sidelines and learning (not only about the series itself and cleaned coins, but also altered and counterfeit, how to identify original skin vs. simply acceptable surfaces, etc) is something you're okay with, by all means do so. However, if walkers indeed stay the focus of your interest, they offer an opportunity not available with every series, and that's early affordability. Even though I personally believe one, if genuinely knowledgeable enough to safely do so, should consider the keys earlier than later, with a set such as walkers there's absolutely nothing wrong with one in your situation working backwards, at least early on, which brings us to......

The short set (for which Dando also makes, or at least made, it's own album). All the necessary coins to complete said set are plentifully available well into higher MS grades at comparatively affordable prices, which means it's a relatively simple and painless set to do, and in fact, many circs can be had for at or very close to scrap. Depending on your tastes you may not have much of an interest in circ grades, but if later on when facing the costly dates in the full set, you may have to settle unless willing to break the bank, so paying attention to later very low value circs now could pay off in the long run. When you complete the short set, if still not ready to tackle the earlier dates, you could always extend it back into the 30'S to a date/mint of your choosing; the beauty of "set" collecting is that there are no must-follow rules, and if an album isn't made for your choice, you can simply buy blanks.

The point is that while it's not necessary, if you're one who wants to collect now rather than later, you do have still-wise options that would also allow you to work towards your end goal while still in the earlier stages of learning.

 

This is the best advice for all collectors! Decades ago, I started a type set with JUST the Keys." I had 1909-S IHC, 55/55 1c, 39-D 5c, 16-D 10c etc. Coins went from VG to BU. It was very slow to form as prices were rising over time. I sold it way before complete (01-S Barber was going to be tough) and did very well.

PROBLEM IS: I have only met two others who were building a date/mint set in a particular series who had the self control to start with the toughest/most expensive coins. That way as prices rise (as they have in the past) the keys to their set are ALREADY IN IT. It's really good in theory but virtually impossible to practice.

 

I don't think beginning collectors should be running out and buying key date coins necessarily. They definitely shouldn't go out and buy key dates raw as a first purchase! Even experienced collectors can benefit from a lesser purchase or 2 to start a set, just to get a feel for it. But, after the first 3 or 4 coins of most series, that's when I think buying keys is worthwhile.

 

Well said. The keys tend to move stably; over the long run your profit as a percentage of initial investment won't change a whole lot in any particular period of time regardless of the starting date. If you're in it solely for the profit margin, of course you arrange to make the largest investments first, but who does a high-end typeset with ultimate profit margin as the major priority? Typesets are a pursuit of passion; those seeking long-term gain are better off just snagging random keys as they become available at a price offering best growth. That might mean your first half-dozen coins are all Morgans or SLQ's or anything else appropriate.

A well-done typeset requires a degree of generalized expertise not available to the newer collector, especially factoring the wide variance in the quality of coins in slabs. The appropriate advice for an experienced collector would not be the same as that due a beginner who chose a typeset as a target, but in every case "know the issue and exercise discipline" is paramount.

 

I agree, a beginner should not buy ANY raw coins. Again, most of this "chatter" depends on the "disposable wealth" of the OP.

 

Question--and the same one that I ask every time someone tells a newbie to "buy the keys first!".

Why would you want to make a mistake on a 1000 dollar coin while you're learning instead of making that mistake on a 100 dollar coin? (or in the case of the OP a 3500 dollar 1921 S in XF rather than a 40 dollar 1917 in XF)

And you WILL make mistakes while learning the ins and outs of a new series--even if you do buy major TPG slabs.

 

Three pieces of advice for the new collector:

1. Do not buy raw coins.

2. Do not buy raw coins.

3. Do not buy raw coins.

And, oh yeah, I almost forgot this: Do not buy raw coins.

 

Note: This is not a condemnation of any post above or any member...just a stepping stone to take it further from a partial quote below. Wish I didn't need to say this before adding this:

You don't need much expertise to do/say anything in numismatics anymore in this day of "slabs" and "chats."

One museum numismatic collection curator and one wealthy dealer mentor started me on that Type Set I referred to. To paraphrase each...

Curator: "So you have a complete collection of Morgan dollars. Very nice. Very hard to complete. Nice potential (back in the early 70's)? Show them to a group of non-numismatists: ZZZZzzzzZZZZZzzzzZZZZ. The type set: I wish I had gone this route while actively collecting."

Dealer: "Eggs in different baskets. Interesting. Discover if there is a particular coin series you want to specialize in. Keys go up faster and are more in demand than their common counterparts."

IMO, now with slabs taking out much of the danger of overpricing, grade, and counterfeits... I'll stick to my opinion.

 

That post was a thoroughly enjoyable read.

I have to differ with what I quoted of it, though. The TPG's are responsible for a dramatic reduction in "quality at grade" via a business model which encourages offering grades too high for the coin. Their customers have a vested interest in higher grades, and they build market share by complying with their customers' needs. It's why Albanese had to form CAC, to correct the backslide from two companies he helped form. It's kind of difficult to accept such an unabashed endorsement of TPG's from someone who goes back to before they were in business, and therefore knows how to grade properly, such as yourself.

I guess it's a question of whether we're individually going to let the TPG's dictate our grading standards, or not. I am not.

 

Sounds like very sage advice. Perhaps you should give us two or three examples of the "MISTAKES" you are referring to in your post so members can comment.

 

After Reading all that has been said, a small set of Walkers sounds best for me. I can focus on that and tackle the full set later. I probably won't start the small set for awhile. I just joined a coin club and I would like to get their feedback too.

 

I agree with you @SuperDave. Let's start a fan club.

I don't let TPGS's opinions influence my purchases AT ALL either BUT we are professionals, not beginners or folks who feel "shaky'" about their authentication/grading skills.

 

Take your time and "vet" the members. Often there are one or two "big fish" in a club who don't know as much as they think or say. Find a good dealer/mentor and you should do very well w/CERTIFIED coins.