Two recent purchases that may have been minted by brothers (according to Crawford). Look at the pic on the lower right and tell me what you think you see. I do not see 4 dots like described in my references and by NAC in Auction 78 # 396, the JD collection. I looked several pages before and after this coin in Crawford and found only one Triens with something other than 4 dots in front of the prow, Cr 206/4, which has a dolphin in front of all bronze prows. Did the celator use the symbol of an As, I, and then add feathering to change the look? on right Cr 173/3 - Triens circa 169-158, Æ 21.5mm., 7.34g. Weight standard based on as of 31.5 grams. Obv - Helmeted head of Minerva, [above, four pellets] Rev. Prow r.; above, C·SAX ligate and before, four pellets. Below ROMA. Babelon Clovia ?. Sydenham 360b. Crawford 173/3. Rare. Brown tone, minor areas of weakness, otherwise Good Very Fine Ex NAC sale R, 2007, 1280 and ex NAC sale 78, 2014, 396. From the JD collection. Crawford notes the design of the of the prow uses two straight lines with dots on the top line like a railing. This feature starts with Cr 173 and continues to Cr 178. Cr 179, Cr 180 and onward have an additional feature. This coin looks like it has a palm frond or feather in front of the prow instead of the normal 4 dots?? on left Cr 180/3 - SAX, Likely a younger brother of C. (Cluvius) Sax(ula), Cr.173. Triens circa 169-158, Æ 23.8mm., 12.7g. Weight standard based on as of 31.5 grams. Obv - Helmeted head of Minerva, above four pellets Rev. Prow r.; above, SAX ligate and before, four pellets. Below ROMA. Babelon Clovia ?; Sydenham 361d; Crawford 180/3. Rare. Brown tone, well centered, Very Fine
i see what you do.....a palm frond or feather instead of dots/pellets...But that may just be an 'artefact' of wear. My triens: Nice pick-ups!!!
I also see a feather. While it is possible that the celator use the symbol of an As accidentally and then add feathering to change the look (everyone makes mistakes), I have to agree with Mike, I think it is a result of wear. But I really like the design of the of the prow uses two straight lines with dots on the top line like a railing. I don't own one of these, so another one for the wish list!
Hmmm => I think that it'd probably be a grain-ear before it was a feather, but who knows, eh? (images in the clouds)
I see what you're talking about but I'm not convinced that it's part of the die. It could potentially be from the flan itself, possibly a slight misalignment in the molds or even just a small chip in one. This coin is scarce enough that there should only be a few die pairs so you may well be able to find a die match somewhere in Vecchi 3 or Goodman that would confirm or deny the presence of the dots on the die. At any rate, it would be really interesting if you have made a discovery.
I see it as a palm frond or feather and think it looks like a purposeful part of the die rather than an artifact of a worn die, funky strike, or other such cause.
Take a look at British Museum: 1865,0811.8 at this link: http://numismatics.org/crro/id/rrc-173.3 I think this one is a reverse die match and based on that I think it is a weird effect of die/mold breakage or possibly corrosion but not an intended part of the devices of the die.
Looking at it again, I think you're right. The feathery edge on the right seems to be the border of an elongated corrosion pit (or mechanical damage). There are/were probably four pellets to the right of the prow.
There's no such thang as too much sax!! ... but I'm a bit of a lyre ... Sestus, Thrace "after" 150 BC Hermes & Lyre
Since no one else has added another SAX to the thread, I'll throw in my sextans(which has nowhere near the eye appeal of RRD's great examples): Roman Republic Æ Sextans(17.9 mm, 5.80g). C. Cluvius Saxula, moneyer, 169-158 BC. Rome mint. Head of Mercury right wearing winged Petasos, •• above / Prow of galley right; C•SAX above, •• before, ROMA below. Crawford 173/5; Sydenham 360d; Babelon Clovia 10 Ex. RBW Collection, Ex. Wayne Phillips list 194, 280, May 1995
Ooops, sorry rrdenarius => I forgot to mention how cool "both" of your OP-coins are (man, I love AE-RR prow examples)
RS - thanks for your comments. I have pondered this a while and tend to agree there probably were 4 dots on the die. The area where the dots should be on the reverse is a poorly struck part of the coin and directly across from a similar poorly struck portion of the obverse. The feathered edge could be where some patina broke on cleaning or the edge of metal flow on the coin. I looked on line and found the two BMC coins and 7 examples between Wildwinds, acsearch.info, CNG, DEAMONETA, etc. This one was not in Vecchi 3. The first BMC coin, posted below, looks like a reverse die match. I am less sure about the obverse die match. I took another look and more pics. The best one is below. I only see 3 dots on the reverse of the BMC coin, but the 4th could start below the dotted line on the ship. With a good imagination, you can see a dot on mine below the ship's dotted line and one even with it. Most of the other coins that show 4 dots have the lowest dot even with the ship's row of dots.
