Why does it seem that the older numismatists

Not over 50 no pony tail. . Usually a baseball cap. Can often be grouchy and have little time for morons tho Barely finished high school don't own a computer and if you saw me you'd never guess I collected or dealt coins. But most here will tell you that I do know most of the time what I'm doing. And I have been wrong on occasion. And I'm the first to admit it. I'm recalling a 78-cc trade that was fooling me from the pic except the mm thought it was an altered genuine not a high grade fake. And I don't get fooled by them often

 

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If he simply liked the coin and thought it worth preserving, wouldn't it be only reasonable for him to explain this to the dealer when asking it if was "worth" submitting? I realize that the concept may be foreign to some, but we all have the responsibility to say what we mean and not expect others to connect the dots. When someone asks you about "worth", what do you assume that to mean?

This all must be taken in context...remember, this gentleman used this experience as an example of understanding the OP's whine regarding terrible old people lying.

Otherwise, fair enough, bustie...

 

I don't think we're disagreeing as much as you might think. Just trying to look at it from all sides. In the end, I'll concede that your perspective is probably the closest to the reality of the situation. Having said that.... @19Lyds had some very valuable things to say earlier, which I think are very well said.

 

After your explanation, I don't think we're disagreeing much at all, and I certainly do agree regarding 19lyds posts.

My issue is, again, the context in which the gentleman presented his experience. As a stand-alone experience I wouldn't have thought much of it, but when used as an example of how he has experienced horrible old people with nothing better to do than needlessly lie to youthful collectors... no.

 

It's too bad. @19Lyds comments were the material that featured threads should be made of; sparking a great discussion. But the rest of this mess gets in the way. If only it had all started with THOSE comments...

 

Based on your unfounded, disrespectful, insults to the senior numismatists here. I would venture to say you are even worse than those you complain about.

 

ALL WELL..ENDS WELL.. WELL FOR A MINUTE ANYWAYS

 

True, although I didn't point it out, there is wisdom to be gained from experienced, old and new numismatists.

 

I wasn't upset about the quarter at all. I didn't get the quarter graded. I asked his opinion on it, because I thought it had too many hits in the mirrored fields. He agreed. So I apologize if my first post was not clear.

The issue I did have though was, he offered $23.57 for the Morgan silver dollar pictured below. I realize it's a very common date. However Just above melt for an example like this is completely ridiculous. When I first showed this exact coin to the owner and he said in his opinion it was an MS 64. So I just thought it was amusing his nephew tried to low ball on it when I took it with me back to the shop. I took 2 Morgans I was considering grading but didn't. Now and again I'll ask what the buy price is on a certain coin to see what different shops and dealers are paying. I realize silver is low and the other factors, but still, $23.57? As I said, ridiculous. So if this is a normal price for a coin like this in today's market I stand corrected. But I recall getting a lot more for a less nicer Morgan back before the 2011 silver rise. Silver then was about 16-17 an Oz.

 

Oh I kept the coin! I did not spend it. I'll have to dig it back out and take some pics.

 

In short, yes preservation, since I don't slab business strikes and on the off chance it is worth something when my daughter is my age since the coin if ever graded is going to her. Woops accidently put my reply in his. LOL sigh.

 

Two old sayings might apply here.

With age comes wisdom,

and...

There is no fool like an old fool.

 

If you don't like the discourse level in this forum, try another. All of them, excepting PCGS, would ban members for posting what I read here every day.

 

First, I appreciate the clarification; thank you.

Now, and I just have to mention this, not to defend anyone but for the sake of fairness; $23.57 isn't "just above melt", but I certainly understand your point. With that said though, it is a raw common Morgan that appears to have a possible spotting issue (my apologies, but I cannot tell for certain from the photo), and paying even wholesale 64 money isn't a wise business move if there is anything open to question. One thing stuck out about your post... that it was the dealer's "nephew" who made the offer and the dealer himself who previously gave the grade opinion. I doubtfully know these people, but it is possible that the nephew isn't trusted enough to make detailed buying decisions on raw coins, and is authorized to make only gen unc offers. Again, I don't know but is a possibility; just as it can be risky for a collector when buying raw, the same can be true for a dealer relying on possibly less experienced help. Also, when judging offers, it is best to always do so, when possible, in context, and should be fairly easy with something like this. His sell (not tagged) price on a comparable coin would be a better indicator of how "reasonable" the offer was as opposed to comparing to that of another dealer. If anything though, I wouldn't pass judgment until/unless I could place that same coin in front of the owner.

I realize this is on a side note, but if simple preservation is your goal, CoinWorld/Amos "standard" (old ANACS-style) holders are as good as a slab and cost just over a buck the last I knew. Oddly enough, the so-called "premium" holders are utter junk, but the aforementioned really are quite nice.

 

Upstart. New member. I want proof of your accusations. Cite posts. Until then, watch the Showtime series, "The Borgias"........

 

well you could be right about the owner not trusting his nephew about that but I know that he trusts his nephew enough to decide what submissions go to NGC or pcgs. when I very first sent something to be graded I was told that he was the expert and in charge of sending in coins to grade for the shop. that was back in 2013 the first time I ever got anything graded that I found in circulation. but I am sure he is also told what coins to send in by the owner.

 

This is definitely one of the more friendly coin sites around and it still gathers its fair share of complaints with regards to rude/abrupt posts. Try NGC or PCGS and see how friendly they can be.

Why so abrupt? Well, I think most "old hands" have heard just about every question at some point in their chat board careers. Everyone starts out trying to give a massive in-depth response that chronicles every possible outcome for the person posing the question. It feels very rewarding when said person responds and appreciates the time spent on their problem especially if it gets resolved. Though quite often the OP never writes back and may not even read the reply.....that gets really disheartening. But then we are given a chance to answer the same question again next week and see how receptive the next person is to our answers on that one. Then said question will be posed again the next week, sometimes by a troll, and the responses get nasty fast.

Everyone here, even after years and years of answering similar questions still tries to answer to the best of their abilities.......sometimes we're wrong......you get what you pay for ;-)

This is a hobby where soooo many people think that their Steel Penny from WWII must be worth a fortune, because somehow old coins have earned a reputation for being valuable. Most aren't.....and the ones that are, are valuable because you will NEVER find one in your pocket! Therefore it is easier for us to take a pessimistic approach to most new "million dollar discovery" threads.

It's all these people who come here to take advantage of our time & knowledge, only to disappear the next day, that leave a bad taste in our mouths.

Not sure why sometimes we coin folks can be rude to someone that has done nothing wrong, maybe it is a bit of elitism, maybe we just do it to poke fun at a stupid question (despite the old saying, YES, there are such things as stupid questions), or maybe we just had a bad day......everyone has 'em. You might notice that most folks who have been at the same job for a long time have a similar attitude. By and large, we all try to be encouraging though.

Btw, I'm 25, so it might not be the age of the poster that causes an attitude as much as how long they've been in the coin world.

 

It is impossible to really say whether or not the newphew was trying to rip you without knowing what their prices usually are. Some places buy low but sell low as well, others buy high but sell high, and some buy low and sell high.

With that said it probably wasn't that far off of an offer with the spot on the reverse for a date than comes very nice overall.

 

Just keep in mind what the internet actually is, as great at it is overall it is a faceless environment that has potential to bring out the worst in people. The vast majority of people will try and give honest answers (whether they're right or wrong is a different story but there is no agenda behind it) but like anywhere else there will be a small percentage that base their answers off self interest. The good thing about a forum is usually other people will correct it.

A forum is really no different than everyday life though in the sense that you just aren't going to agree with or even get along with every single person you come across. It is what it is, can't have thin skin on the internet just don't let it bother you and ignore things that get childish. There is a lot of good info and some bad info, use the info as a starting point to look into things more on your own from different sources and take advantage of it as a learning experience without getting worked up about things

 

This place can be contentious, although quite frankly I've seen a marked improvement over the last few months, but it's only because the membership tolerates it from each other. The Moderators cannot and should not be babysitters, and the more you Moderate the less effective Moderation is. You become just another voice, until it's so far out of control you either ban everyone or completely lose your authority. Moderation shouldn't be a 24/7 job - trust me on this, I've tried it.

To an extent - one that falls short of "armchair moderation" - the membership of any online community is self-regulating via peer pressure. It's that interaction which sets the tone and behavior of a forum, not the rules or actions of the Moderators. If it's like this here, it's because we created it.

I don't say this in defense of any poor-mannered poster here, but those of us who have been participating in this and similar fora for many years have received far more abuse at the hands of new people who won't be convinced their coin isn't the next million-dollar find, those who refuse to learn even when you physically force the book up their nose, and those who just plain feel like trolling for a while before they move on, than any heaped upon any newbie. You want to talk about getting tired of abuse? That's tired of abuse.

Yet we're still here posting.