What do you expect "High Grade" to mean?

These are business strikes I culled from a $250 Mint bag. In all, I submitted 54 to NGC........

MS66 - 2 (I gave these away as gifts to kids)
MS67 - 38 (I sold 27 for an average of $20, and I still have 11)
MS68 - 14 (I sold all of these for an average of $150 each)

Chris

 

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To me, anything above a '65 is high grade. I suppose the term is subjective........

 

To me, high grade is the grade above the highest population grade or price plateau. On ebay high grade equals pass on by.

 

But how would you interpret it when someone says, "PCGS gave this coin a high grade." This would not be a relative statement such as "PCGS gave this coin a higher grade than I thought" or "PCGS gave this coin the highest grade among coins of the same year/variety."

In the context of PCGS/NGC, would we assume that high grade means MS6X? Or maybe go a notch or two below... maybe AU-55?

Or, would the person technically be mistaken to use the term "high grade" in an absolute sense, and should instead say what exactly the grade is? Conversely, I was thinking that "high grade" would be a standard range between MS-60 and MS/PR/PF-70, since "high grade" may be indirectly standardized by those top TPG's, as coins must be able to break that minimum uncirculated MS-60 barrier.

 

What this person really is saying is "PCGS gave this coin a grade which is higher than I'm used to seeing." Or, they could mean "They gave this coin a grade somewhat high on the scale, relatively speaking." Or they could mean, "They gave this coin a grade much higher than I expected." Or, "F- it all, I'm just hoping you buy my marketing gimmick."

No. You can make no assumptions. Check the data, check the pops, check the guides, check the references. Is it high grade compared to your set? Is it high grade compared to the average quality for the date? Is it high grade in an absolute sense (on a 1-70 Sheldon scale)? Is it high grade compared to numismatics at large? What are you comparing it to? If you compare it to pocket change, MS-64 is high grade. If you compare it to 2014 Silver Eagles, MS-64 is incredibly low grade. Do you begin to see why this "high grade" nonsense makes no sense?

Yes, finally! Only in an absolute scale does this begin to make sense! State what the grade is - back it up with facts. If the coin is technically better than the vast majority of its peers, then you can use superlatives. Otherwise, it is just marketing!

For some coins, VF-30 is the best you can ever hope to find. For some, MS-70 is common. There is no universal "high grade."

 

Yes, if there's a numerical grade available, then "high grade" doesn't mean squat. Consider the source on the grade itself, of course.

Something like "highest grade among coins of the same year/variety" is usually referred to as "top pop," rather than "high grade."

 

I wish the scale was out of 100... then maybe "high grade" would develop into an established range, such as an "A" grade range of 90-100...

On that note, why don't we change the scale's range? Are the TPG's too used to the Sheldon 70-point scale?

 

What is the difference between 70 and 100 being the top grade? Absolutely nothing. In the 1-70 scale, UNC is 60-up.

The term "high grade" is meaningless now. It would be meaningless in a 100 point scale. It would be meaningless in an A-F scale. It will always be meaningless.

 

Unless the TPG's made the term "high grade" synonymous with "Mint State", right? lol. But nah, they won't do that given the subjective nature of that term... as you now know, that's what I was getting at earlier - if somehow "high grade" was generally known to refer to the MS-6X range by convention, as that's what the top TPG's have established.

 

The TPGs haven't established anything. That's the whole point of what I'm saying. They grade a coin based on its merits, on a 1-70 scale. The coin speaks for itself. If its a 65, it is a 65. No story, no hype, just the grade.*

Once the coin leaves the TPG, the marketers take over and apply a whole host of superlatives to try and convince you to buy their wares. This is where the "high grade" stuff comes in.







*The cynics in the room will strongly disagree with these statements. For the sake of simplicity, let's just let this one slide.

 

Having two terms that mean exactly the same thing ("high grade" vs "mint state"), one of which is very generic-sounding and the other which is a very specific thing already, would not add anything to the hobby.

 

True

 

I expect they're trying to mislead me. For example, there's an eBay seller that labels all their rolls of Satin Finish Mint Set coins, high grade. I do not expect them to be the highest grades, 68's/69's, even though the ad would suggest this, since those are the high grades for these coins.

 

I'm not a fan of the term "high grade", which is why I created this thread in the first place. It was nice to play devil's advocate for a while there to generate some interesting discussions.

That said, I will add this... "high grade" exists absolutely no matter how you look at it: MS/PRooF-70.

 

Here is the way I would use the term legitimately. I might be casually browsing a dealer's case as I am wont to do. He might say, "looking for anything in particular?" My response might be, "I'm looking for high grade raw U.S. proofs from the 1936-1942 era, cents on up." Now either he might have some 64-66ish raw proofs or he may not, but that'd be what I'm talking about.

My last run of coins to NGC had five of 'em. Lowball of 64RB up to a 65+ war nickel.

On the other hand, if I say, "I'm looking for high grade recent modern business strike coins, certified", I want to see NGC or PCGS stuff with a minimum grade of MS67.

 

I agree its all about marketability ive bought coins that were high grade but were no better than in good condition but in all fairness i usually got them with other coins or in bulk so i really never complained i bought an 1844 O Seated liberty half for 70 bucks free shipping with a pcgs case all it says is vf details from scratch it has all 13 stars, reeds are in above average condition and the reverse has the original silver tone off the wings of the Eagle in my opinion it was a good buy and i would sell it with a high grade status even tho it only says vf details on the case. Thank you

 

On ebay I've become inclined to believe "High Grade" means that they were high when they graded it.

 

"High grade" to me is relative to where a coin falls in its actual grade. You can have a "high grade" VG-10 (one which just misses F-12) just like you can have a "low grade" MS-68 (one that just barely misses MS-67)

 

How many sellers on ebay use the term "low grade"? LOL