How do you know if your coin is a diecrack or a cud.

I need help. Diecracks looks like scratches to me.

 

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Does this help?

http://coinauctionshelp.com/diecracksminterror.html

Also this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Die_defect

"A die crack occurs when a die, after being subjected to immense pressure during the minting process, cracks, causing a small gap in the die. If this damaged die continues to produce coins, the metal will fill into the crack, thus revealing a raised line of metal in the finished coin"

(Die cracks are raised, whereas scratches have displaced metal and are therefore "sunk" into the coin)

"A cud is a variation of a die defect in which the coin bears a raised portion of metal. Unlike a die crack, this unintentional "bump" in the coin is caused by a dent or gouge in the die, therefore allowing the coin to fill into the gap during the minting process. A very minuscule cud can look like a small chunk of metal that was somehow fused to the coin... A prominent cud looks like a blank section of a coin, usually toward the rim of the coin."​

 

Not really

 

I want to know how to identify the errors

 

A crack or cud the metal will be raised from the surface of the coin like the design a scratch will be dug into the surface. If you look with a loupe it will be plainly obvious. This has a crack up the left side not a good pic but you can see it connecting the stars

 

A cud is a raised "blob looking thing" on that edge of the coin, mostly on the edge, the edge of the die would have chipped off leaving that raised area, some people consider it a kind of die break, others don't. A die crack is a long narrow raised "scratch" anywhere on the coin, made after many coins have been struck and the die starts to crack in some places. A die break is almost like a cud except it can happen anywhere on the coin, it happens when part of the die breaks off.

Note: Any thing that involves the die cracking, breaking, or breaking in any kind of way will result in a raised error, never sunken.

Here's a cud that I found in circulation.

Here is a coin demonstrating a die break

Here is a coin with a die crack.

 

Read info with understanding. Die crack on coin surface is a protrusion. A scratch on coin surface is incuse.

Maybe the text was too small, here it is again...

Die crack (raised)...





Scratches (embedded)...

 

ummm, not exactly. A cud is simply a die crack which reaches the rim in two points--not a dent or gouge. The piece of die which is broken may or may not be retained on the die, itself.

This is a die crack...


This is a retained cud (The broken piece of die is still attached to the body of the die)...


This is dropped cud (the broken piece has fallen off the die)...

 

But, if the elevation of the cracked piece does not change, your definition remains as a die crack, no? That elevation change implies a gouge, dent or pushed in chunk into the die, regardless of whether or not it retains part of the design on it. That's my understanding.

 

I have two Morgan Dollars with a similar radial die crack, I never paid any premium for them though. I guess the area around the legend towards the obverse rim gets the most stress.

 

Now we are back to arguing semantics again. Technically, any die crack which causes a piece of the die to break off results in a cud. With a dent or gouge the material is simply shoved back into the item. (For example consider a door ding on your car.) With a cud the material is completely broken away from the die--even it still being held in place by the press. That's why retained cuds in general only occur on the anvil die--if on the hammer die the piece would fall out almost immediately.



This is a die gouge. The die was damaged by something being forced into it. The material isn't missing, it's merely moved.

 

Cool Die. Is that yours?

 

No, I'm just trying to absorb your correction.

I don't get the meaning behind your correction of the definition. A die crack which reaches the rim in two points is a die crack, no? When the elevation of a cracked piece changes, hence the word "raised" in the definition of cud, then it becomes a cud. That change in elevation, compared to the rest of the die surface, comes across as a dent, gouge, pushed in piece, chip, etc. No?

Please clarify your correction, just for me, am I ok to call all die cracks that touch the rim in two spots, a cud, without looking for raised metal?

 

Afraid not...borrowed pic (with permission) from Ken Potter.

http://koinpro.tripod.com/bio.htm

 

Technically, yes, even though it usually wouldn't be called one. In the real world, you will find relatively few coins where the break doesn't result in raised metal though since the broken piece will be shoved along the shaft of the die fairly quickly from the pressure of minting more coins.

 

So, both of these are cuds...

 

Strictly speaking, yes. Actually, the lower coin appears to show some movement.

 

http://www.error-ref.com/

 

This is the worst definition of a cud I've ever seen. Wiki sucks!

 

Appreciated.

See, this is what they say about the NW section of this cent...

I also see movement.



Now, to me, a pre-cud die crack is still a die crack. I don't know anymore. I interpret it as pre-cud, hence, no cud, not yet.

http://www.error-ref.com/page/2/?s=cud

@okbustchaser May I please get a reference point for your definition, again, just for me.