Fun with Feuchtwanger Token Varieties

Discussion in 'Coin Chat' started by geekpryde, Nov 14, 2014.

  1. geekpryde

    geekpryde Husband and Father Moderator

    This is a simple write-up of how I went about determining the Die-Pair for a CAC approved Feuchtwanger Token I recently purchased. Sometimes the die-pair is listed on the TPG slab, (I often see this on NGC tokens), but in my case PCGS did not list it so I was forced to do some actual research. :eek:

    I found a few sites that could help me, but one in particular was very helpful. The primary Site I used to attribute my token's variety: NovaNumismatics.com

    I recommend you read that attribution article, as it provides some nice historical background.

    The Feuchtwanger Cent (Token) is referred to as HT-268 or HT268. The "HT" represents "Hard-Times".

    My Coin:

    1837 1C HARD TIMES TOKEN, 1837 NY FEUCHTWANGER COMP PCGS AU58 30674644 CAC Obv Closeup.jpg
    1837 1C HARD TIMES TOKEN, 1837 NY FEUCHTWANGER COMP PCGS AU58 30674644 CAC Rev Closeup.jpg

    Initially, I attributed the coin based on seller photos. While fairly decent photos, it was hard due to the lack of resolution of the finer details. Still, before the coin arrived in the mail from my favorite coin seller (www.bozarthnumismatics.com) I had determined to the best of my ability the variety.

    Seller photos:

    1837 1C HARD TIMES TOKEN, 1837 NY FEUCHTWANGER HT-268(6G) PCGS AU58 30674644 CAC Obv Slab Seller.jpg

    1837 1C HARD TIMES TOKEN, 1837 NY FEUCHTWANGER HT-268(6G) PCGS AU58 30674644 CAC Rev Slab Seller.jpg


    The Obverse die is referred to as a number: one (1) through six (6).
    The Reverse die is referred to as a letter: A through I.

    I am not going to reproduce all the Attribution Instructions as those are proprietary and are found on the site I listed above. But here are the basics:

    Obverse
    Counting from RIGHT to LEFT does the third tail feather touch the ground? YES
    Does the first feather touch the snake? YES
    Is the base of the 7 in the date at the same position as the base of the 3? YES

    FEUCHTWANGER Obv Closeup with lines.jpg

    YES to those three questions --> Obverse 6.

    Reverse
    According to the site I used, Obverse 6 has only 3 possible Reverse dies. (A, G, I)

    Immediately to the left of the bow, is there a stem without berry? NO
    Is there 12 berries total? NO

    FEUCHTWANGER Rev Closeup with lines.jpg


    NO to both those questions --> Reverse 'G'

    Conclusion
    So, together my variety is 6G or HT268(6G). 6G supposedly has a rarity of R3.

    As you can see from the photos on that site, the different die pairs (varieties) have quite distinguishable looks.

    This is the first time I have ever really looked into die-pairs for ANY coin I own, so if I made any mistakes as to the language or method, please let me know. Do you agree with what I concluded as to my token's variety?



    1837 1C HARD TIMES TOKEN, 1837 NY FEUCHTWANGER COMP PCGS AU58 30674644 CAC Obv Slab.jpg



     
    Last edited: Nov 14, 2014
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  3. Jwt708

    Jwt708 Well-Known Member

    I tried to double check your work but I get a 403 error when I attempt to access the website. Looks like a reasonable conclusion.
     
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  4. Numismat

    Numismat World coin enthusiast

    I don't really collect US coins, but I do have a Feuchtwanger among the handful of US coins I do keep. Never researched the die pairings, but got mixed responses when I posted it on another forum way back when I first got it.

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
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  5. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    I'll double check you when I have a chance but that probably won't be until sometime tomorrow night. (I'm at work and the information is on my laptop. I won't get a chnace to get to it until late tomorrow.)

    I think I have some images of some of the dies that website is missing. I think I may have pictures of all but one of the dies now.
     
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  6. geekpryde

    geekpryde Husband and Father Moderator


    Looks like yours is 6G as well?
     
  7. geekpryde

    geekpryde Husband and Father Moderator

    Weird, maybe I suddenly drove too much traffic there?

    It is currently working for me.
     
  8. Aidan_()

    Aidan_() Numismatic Contributor

    It's a very nice piece geek. ;)
    Like the research you put into it.

    I forgot to mention, in the close up on the date (1st pic), why does the 3 look like a 5? Die wear?
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2014
  9. deacon2828

    deacon2828 Active Member

    I have 6-g as a R_2 !
     
  10. Conder101

    Conder101 Numismatist

    I confirm the OP as a 6G.

    Turns out I am also still missing images of reverses c and F. Not too surprising as they both only come on R-8 varieties.
     
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  11. deacon2828

    deacon2828 Active Member

    I have them,! is this Mike ?
     
  12. geekpryde

    geekpryde Husband and Father Moderator

    PM Conder, he may want to collect some images, and possibly email the author of that article I linked in the OP. Apparently not too many people have seen these varieties.
     
  13. geekpryde

    geekpryde Husband and Father Moderator

    Thank you, sir!
     
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