Rare coin in a SEGs holder.....

I distincly recall eBay stores selling only SEGS-graded coins and there were a ton of problems. I also remember reading the owner of the store was the one doing the grading. There's a chance I'm getting them confuzed with another one. This was a few years ago.

People are skepticle so if it's legit you might get a lower bid, just because.

 

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http://larrybriggsrarecoins.com/index.php?route=information/information&information_id=4

 

Think so? Crack out one of your cheap coins in a top 4 slab and send it to SEGS. Let's see the before and after. Talk is cheap without action.

 

If I recall correctly, both SEGS and ICG started within a short time of one another, perhaps within a year of one another, in the late 1990s. There was considerable optimism at that time with their entry since PCGS was not quite the powerhouse that it has become. NGC was considered much more on a par with PCGS, though their grading "dark days" of the mid-1990s hurt them, and ANACS wasn't viewed with nearly the skepticism that they are today. Additionally, the old PCI holders had many nice coins in them and had a market presence that was accepted as legitimate.

It was hoped by many that both SEGS and ICG would add pressure to the certification businesses and lower submission costs while increasing quality. The SEGS holder was looked at with excitement given you could see what the coin was in the holder without removing it from the box. When they started, SEGS seemed to have a lower profile than ICG and the grading standards of ICG appeared to be on par with PCGS. Unfortunately, over time the grading standards at ICG seemed to morph into something more liberal and the definition of market acceptable at SEGS looked to be different than that at NGC or PCGS. Within about two years of opening shop, both SEGS and ICG lost market share within most numismatic niche markets. ANACS and PCI did, too, and NGC lost some traction with respect to PCGS in classic coinage. The bizarre business switch in the mid-2000s for ANACS and ICG, along with the re-invention of PCI has led each of these to struggle mightily in the eyes of many dealers and collectors while the definition of market acceptable for SEGS seems to have precluded a broader acceptance into the hobby-industry.

Some of this is opinion while others bits of the above are from memory and the dates might be off a bit. Regardless, I do not believe SEGS can be considered as a fly-by-night company.

 

So who among you bid for this coin? I noticed it has 1 bid so far. I guess it indeed was worth the $40 the gentleman bought it off me for.

 

No, like a lot of people I think you are confusing SEGS with SGS. SEGS began in 1998 long before the self slabbers began (because generic shells did not exist at the time.) The self slabbing phenomenon didn't really begin until around 2003.

SEGS and ICG both began in 1998 within just a couple months of each other.

 

Definitely looks retoned, ie artificial toning. It even says that on the slab. If it's genuine ( I don't know for sure), then it would probably command a Vf price guide price, probably at the very least. Maybe NCS might take it in and fix it up and grade it. Maybe not. Or ngc would give it a details grade which would be nice too.

 

Someone picked up my SEGS 50 Cent Columbian 1892 MS-64 today. It was one of my featured store coins. Whatever your opinion of SEGS slabs may be people do buy them and I noticed they seem to be commanding very respectable prices nowadays both in auction and at fixed price listings.

 

I just remember some really shady stuff years back on eBay.

I also remember them getting a much better reputation over time.

What I saw back then wasn't "opinion" if they are slabbing cleaned/probelm coin as overgrade MS's, or MS's as overgraded proofs.

(and I mean obvious ones)

Also, I remember stores that sold 100% SEGS and although *maybe* the person used them exclusively but hearsay at the time was the eBay store was owned by the self-slabber. I'm sure the store is long gone and I lost the specifics (and don't want to post what could be false accusations). I don't think ICG started out quite the same way but I've seen quite a few problems slip by them.

That might be nice for higher-end coins. As long as there is a return policy I'm willing to take a look and if it's as listed it's mine. ICG, SEGS and even ANACS sometimes slip by the auctions because of trepidation.

 

excellent write up.

I do remember SEGS in their early days and submitted to them at the time.
They were accurate and fair.

 

I examined the SEGS prototype slab at a show in Cincinnati in 1998. It was even more massive than the final product. I slabbed with SEGS in their early years but decided to cross the better coins in SEGS slabs over to PCGS once their reputation began to suffer. Most of those coins slabbed at the same grade; a few went down by a point or two and several went UP by a point or two.
I know and respect Larry-it's too bad SEGS wasn't handled properly from the start-they could have been a real player in the slabbing grade. And I agree with the statement that the holder is the best in the business.

 

BTW-I see I'm listed here as a new member. I had to update my email address but I've been here since 2004. Don't post too regularly but I hope to become more active here.

 

The beginning of the end for ICG occurred when they listed hundreds of PR70 coins in the old Teletrade printed catalogs. I don't know who was responsible for that move but it sure hurt the legitimacy of ICG.

I used to slab with SEGS during the first 4 or 5 years of their existence-I was generally quite pleased with them then. But I haven't slabbed with them for a long time. I will say this-Larry Briggs knows a lot more about coins and coin grading, especially in the Seated Liberty stuff than most numismatists.

 

It's sad how the coin turned out, would've never thunk.

 

You really never thought in concept that any coin graded normally cracked out of any third rate tpg would do badly at pcgs or ngc? Really?

 

well, then welcome anyway!

j/k

 

Ofcourse, don't be silly. I thought that SEGS was in Tier 2, after PCGS and NGC along with ANACS and ICG. Which essentially means, the grader can grade the coin slightly off by a couple points, or some minor errors. This is huge. Cleaning on a coin? I thought SEGS was atleast a little reputable... I guess not.

 

Third rate tpg's routinely slab coins cleaned or problem coins as gradeable. That is why they are third rate tpg's.

 

Nothing "huge" or really that surprising about it.

 

I'll bet those were SGS coin slabs