Okay, is this one MS or AU?

Here's a classic slider coin. Do you call it MS or AU? Please give opinions and rationale for your call. I thought this one was an excellent grading exercise:

 

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What does 'slider' mean?

Serious question by the way as ive seen it several times up here but im not familiar with the term

 

Oh and would the correct term for something like this be more along the lines of 'BU'? Or is BU reserved for 65 and up?

 

A "slider" is usually a high grade AU coin that ends up grading MS. That is the general definition--that it slides by as a MS coin. It can also be used in the context of a coin that is borderline in terms of grading--low level MS with no wear, but lots of dings, or AU with marginal wear. AU 58 grades are classic sliders.

 

I thought that was the general context, thanks for clarifying.

 

I think you have the wrong definition. The term applies to MS coins that were collected many years in the past. Rather than slabs, envelopes, 2X2's or flips collector coins were stored in fabric lined compartmentalized drawers in a "coin cabinet". Over time the coin would "slide" around on the fabric (velvet?) and begin to show very slight wear. The coin never circulated yet did reflect very minor wear on the high points - thus a "slider".

 

It's a nice coin, but I am suspicious of the dull grey break in luster both just above the ear on the obverse and on the eagle's breast on the reverse. So I have to go with AU.
BTW, an AU coin with nice surfaces could be far preferable to a MS coin with lots of dings. Of course, you also have to be careful what you pay for it.

 

That is one derivation of the definition for sure. As of recent, with TPG grading, it has come to mean a coin that could grade either way, depending on whether or not the rub was seen as wear, or just marks from storage. At any rate, it has come to be a good, working definition of a "borderline MS" coin.

 

It could just be the pics but I'm going with AU. There appears to be luster breaks on some of the high points. There are also breaks in the eagle's feather lines. And the breast feathers appear to be flat. Even if it is a weak strike, put these together and i think there is a smidge of wear. Nice coin with nice patina and nice surfaces, but I'm going with AU.

 

A strong 55 or a weak 58, IMO...

But since it's not in PCGS plastic (appears to be either ANACS or ICG), the label says 61

 

This is my understanding as well. And believe me, I haven't seen anyone offering unc prices for au sliders. Remember the game Shoots & Ladders? You need a ladder to go up, slide(ers) go down (in price). To say a price slides up sounds more like a new marketing scheme.

As for this coin, hard to tell from the pics, what I see on the high points may be bag marks/rub from other coins, so it may be unc.

 

The word "slider" has adopted new meaning over the years. Nowadays, many use it to describe very strong AU specimens. But some stretch its meaning too far and use it to describe a choice AU coin.

And precious metals wholesalers absolutely offer unc prices for "slider" dollars, although I'm not sure how I feel about that practice - it's all too common. Provident, APMEX, etc pay good money for "sliders".

 

Yeah? I didn't think PM wholesalers offered much of numismatic premium for anything. If they do, you'd think they'd offer more for a tue unc as opposed to a slider. Athough over priced, even HSN sells sliders for less than uncs. Or are their uncs actually sliders and there sliders are actually XF's?

 

The prices being paid for unc Morgan/Peace dollars have skyrocketed lately. Couldn't tell you why, but they have.

And it depends on who you sell it to as to what kind of premium you'll get for true "uncs" compared to "sliders". The larger wholesalers will probably look at a 63/64 the same way they'll look at a "slider". Why? Because they're selling them in bulk - by the bag or by the roll. So mix in some 63s and 64s with some "sliders" in a lot of 20 and you've just made yourself a "bu roll", by their standards at least

And we all know HSN "sliders" are actually polished XFs

 

No offense, but please explain to me how tarnished, corroded (or 'toned' in the current vernacular) coins can even be remotely described as resembling any sort of "mint state."

It's not a horrible looking coin, and it doesn't have a lot of noticeable dings, but "mint state?"

 

Couldn't agree more :thumb:

 

Looks MS to me. Give her a MS64.

 

Well, if they're paying the same for sliders & uncs, it's because they're under paying for uncs, not because they're over paying for sliders.

 

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. I personally like NICE toning, not ugly blotchy toning that has advance to heavy or pitted corrosion.