Looking for your thoughts on the Ike below. Anyone willing to give their thoughts on the grade? I know Ike's, especially Proof Ikes, can be all over the place, but wanted to see what you guys think. I'll start off by saying it is not a PR69, so we can start there... I will let everyone know what PCGS says the coin is after 7 days. Thanks!
I'm always hesitant with ikes, moreso the business strikes. Anyhows, I'm taking a complete guess because I've been spoiled by rlmcent's polls with much larger images. On the other hand, I sometimes over think things with too much to work with. So I'll go with my gut and assume the reverse isn't really that chatty, that it's just dust or something similar. PR-68CAM.
It seems to me that so much of grading modern proofs has to do with hairlines and pitting that you can only see under magnification, so it's really impossible to do it with a small pic. It's definitely got decent cameo contrast, but whether it's CAM or DCAM is also difficult to tell from the lighting. So I'll pick something middle-of-the-road: PR67CAM.
Sorry for not listing this earlier, and it may not effect anyones grades, but the coin is a DCAM. Not that I agree with this designation, but it sort of adds to the story.
Well I don't know if my experience with Kennedy's translates into Ikes, but I have yet come across a lower-grade proof that had a DCAM designation. If the cameo on those proofs is the result of fresh, polished dies, then it might stand to figure that any pitting or chatter would be considerably reduced by a strike with those dies, thereby raising the overall grade.
I would have to see additional photos for a proof. The lighting and angles of the lighting can make ALL the difference in the world. What I WILL say is that the Obverse has a tremendous strike for a 1971 Ike and frosting is nice. IMO, the reverse holds it back some. I'll throw out a guess of 67, but its a better coin than many (IMO improperly graded) PF-68's. With that Obverse strike I can't fathom a 65, but what I hinted at earlier, lighting on a proof can hide an awful lot of flaws.
Given the fact that its a proof means that detailed photo's are an absolute must to9 determine grade since hairlines and minor hits/knicks simply cannot be seen in an online photo. Especially one so small. But, you've stated its a DCAM and PCGS has simply gone way overboard in grading IKE Proofs anymore that each grade they issue is just questionable. The IKE Group has called them onto the carpet in addition to some of the varieties selling for quite handsome prices. I see its a pegleg and PCGS can have selective grading woith these since a lot of the valuable IKE's are of this obverse design. But you want a guess? I could take the safe road and think that your surprised at the grade and say PR65DCAM or I could go with what my gut says and toss out a PR66DCAM. However, given the lack a detailed photo's, I won't qualify or stand behind either guess since that all they are. Guesses based upon the textual matter of the thread.
Thanks to everyone that voted. Sorry the photos weren't the best, but you guys have given me some good insight. 19Lyds is the winner, but then again it was actually his coin before it came to be in my collection. After seeing the coin in hand, PR65 DCAM seems like a crime. I'm not saying it should go all the way up to PR69, but PR67 DCAM would be acceptable. Even more so when you look at the full designation of the coin... With this coin, any increase in grade is a huge jump in potential, and I really don't see how it could come back lower than it already is. The reward of cracking it out to resubmit definately seems to outway the risk. Let me know what you guys think.
Wow, 65 is rough. I've heard from Ike collectors that PCGS has gotten really tough on Proof Ike's lately. This would certainly prove that true. Most Ike collectors know that MOST PF-69 Ike's are not 69 coins. I've got a couple that are just horrid, but I digress. All that I ask from PCGS is consistency and it seems they've gone overboard. Personally I would wait to crack this out until the dust settles at PCGS. IMO, they can't get much tougher on Ike proofs than they are right now. When they have a more concrete standard for IKEs, you may have more confidence cracking it.
That is the current plan. My original thought was that since it is a special designation coin, and a pretty rare one, that they really tightened the screws on the grade. I had thought about cracking it, submitting it as just a Silver Proof for grading and after it comes back then resubmitting for attribution, but that is too much time and effort. I'll wait a bit, and then we'll see what happens when the dust settles.
Are there any hairlines on the coin not visible in the photo? That's the only way I could justify a 65 grade on that coin, FWIW.
