Passing off damaged Silver Eagles as regular ones

Why are ASE's discounted and considered damaged if they have a very light tarnish? It seems like you can just dip it in Ezest or something similair and it will look brand new. There are several youtube videos of guys dipping slightly tarnished eagles and when they pull them out they look like they came out of a BU roll. I know that places that sell bullion online like Apmex have a section just for these. Why would they do this if you can buy eagles a discount just to dip them and re-sell them as new? I know there is one online place that scratches a huge X into it to prevent this.

 

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According to whom?

They also show signs of the dipping as well, and in a lot of cases, the original luster can be removed from over dipping.

NFN but, the bullion eagles, are really worth melt plus up to $5 over melt anyway.

 

Yes but what if it is a quick dip just to remove light rim toning or tarnish?

 

Ooops I don't know how I answered your quote inside your reply. BUuncirculated

 

Why would anyone do things to them anyway? Most SAE's are only bullion coins at this point anyway. I
would buy it just for the silver. I think most people would. No need to pretty them up. They are 999 silver, so any kind of dipping or cleaning may just tarnish the surface since they are so soft.

 

I know this which is why I'm asking why Online places and even coin stores will discount them when you can just dip them and they will look brand new.

 

I am asking why places that sell ASE's would lose money by disounting them when they could dip them and sell them as new. And people do things to them because some want a perfect looking ASE not not splotchy toned or tarnished thing.

 

Why bother with a bullion eagle?

 

Are eagles truly bullion? Most people I know that collect want BU eagles. There is a reason they sell for $3-8 over spot. Also, to answer your question of why major dealers don't dip their coins, it is because they purchase these coins as damaged and pay less anyway. It would be pretty sleazy to buy damaged coins then sell them as BU.

 

Why bother? Because I like them. I have bought both "damaged" and regular eagles. I don't think I'm wording my posts correctly. The point of my original post was to ask why so many online sites and coin shops will sell lightly tarnished eagles at a discount, when they could dip them and sell them at a full premium?

 

I consider them bullion. Just bullion with a premium.

 

They couldn't dip them and sell them at a full premium. Why don't they take second hand silver bars, dip them, and sell them as new? It's the same logic.

 

Yes, yes they are. Whoever said you can buy bullion for spot price? I never have. "Premium" bullion, struck by a government in .999 fine, is always worth a premium over spot pricing.

When the day comes when some date of an ASE sells for twice bullion value, then I would say that date is numismatic value, not bullion. Most ASE's are not in that category. A person can collect anything they like, in fact an ASE collection is great, you get the fun of collecting while having PM value as a protection. I highly recommend "collecting" bullion purchases. Make it fun, so you get more than just PM values from your purchases.

 

Why not? I bet you that almost no one on this board, (including myself), can tell the difference between a new ASE and one dipped properly once. Overdipping will only really show if you do it badly, or if its been dipped 3 or 4 times. After a number of dips, the luster will become impaired, (still not an issue for a bullion purchase really).

 

I agree with you for the most part. My collection consists of only bullion. I have 40% and 90% junk to MS silver. I also have multiple tubes of eagles, 10oz, and 1oz bars. The reason I think eagles may be slightly numismatic is because of the premiums. Bullion bars can be purchased at $1 over spot. These eagles can not. On the other hand, Engelhard and JM bars may command larger premiums than ASEs proving your point as a form of premium bullion. However, would you pay full ASE premium for a scratched eagle? Probably not which means they are slightly numismatic.

 

Good post, this is what I was trying to say but I guess I suck at trying to get my point across.

 

Scratched? IDK I guess. I sure would for toned ones. If it were scratched up maybe I would pay $1 less if I were in the market for them. My concern would be if the scratch lowered the weight of them.

For full disclosure the last ASE I bought for myself was a roll of 1986 ones. Any others I have bought over the years were for gifts to others. I always bought junk silver coins, (90%), because I got more silver per $ than with ASE's. However, if junk 90% is worth spot, I fully understand why .9999 would be worth more than spot. Having it in a easily recognized form is worth a lot, which is why I am not a strong believer in bars, since bars need to be reassayed if you go to sell.

 

When I saw the title of this thread, I thought for sure you were talking about things like this:



I had this thing up as a no reserve auction last week along with some generic BU Mercury & Roosevelt Dimes. To my absolute amazement, this thing outperformed all of my other auctions. Click on the photo above to see the E-Bay listing. What is the world coming to when toning hurts value but painting a coin does not.

 

Dipping = damage. Think about it; you're talking about using chemicals to strip off the outer layer of the coin.

Reputable sellers would note that a coin appears to be dipped, and not price it as a BU example.

That said, toning has only recently become a desirable attribute for coins, and even then, only for certain collectors. In the past, blast white coins with natural surfaced commanded quite a premium over even 'rainbow' toned examples of the same.