A Stephen penny worthy of discussion

Discussion in 'World Coins' started by Assur, Dec 14, 2012.

  1. Assur

    Assur Junior Member

    Stephen pennies are always my favourates. I got this one recently. Maybe not the best example but it is worthy of discussion. Here I attached its photos. You can read the moneyer as PILLEM so Willem. But the mint signiture is too weak. I believe the last letter of the mint signiture is an S. You can find the S just before the initial mark from the reverse.
    obverse.JPG reverse.JPG
    Now the question comes. If it is surely an S, what mint is it? As I know, Canterbury, Launceston, Lewes and several other mints had the moneyer PILLEM of the first type of Stephen coinage. But if it is an S, I think only Launceston fits as it reads LANS. No other mint of PILLEM will has an S in their signitures, and other mints of S had no PILLEM.
    So I'm believing it is from Launceston. But another question comes. All dies of Launceston PILLEM pennies read PILLEM:ON:LANSA. I haven't found any die with LANS. No letter except the probable S of the mint signiture can be visible. What a pity!
    What do you think of it, my friends?
    Assur
     
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  3. FrankPlantagenet

    FrankPlantagenet New Member

    Very impressive, I hope I find one and don't have to pay for one!

    How much did that cost if you don't mind me asking?
     
  4. PaddyB

    PaddyB Eccentric enthusiast

    A lot rests on reading that last letter as an S - which is difficult to be sure of from the photos. My North seems to indicate Newcastle with a Willem moneyer, and a latin abbreviation of CAS - is that another possibility? Of course if it is an E there are other possibilities.

    A very nice coin nevertheless! My Stephen, below, I got about 7 years ago and cost me GBP 170 then - I am happy with it although we will never know the moneyer or mint.

    Stephen Penny 2.jpg
     
  5. FrankPlantagenet

    FrankPlantagenet New Member


    Very nice
     
  6. Assur

    Assur Junior Member

    Thank you PaddyB!
    The S is not clear in the photo but much better if having it in hands. Actually, I thought of the possiblity of Newcastle at first. North listed it but the BMC and Mack didn't. And IMO, this penny doesn't look like the northern dies. So I ruled it out.
    Orther PILLEM can be seen from Canterbury (CANT), Launceston (LANSA), Lewes (LEPE), Norwich (NORPI/NOR), and the mysterious DELCA mint. Maybe there are some more, but I haven't find the proof yet. So if we can be sure the last letter is an S, the only possibility will be Launceston, a very rare mint.
     
  7. Assur

    Assur Junior Member

     
  8. FrankPlantagenet

    FrankPlantagenet New Member

     
  9. PaddyB

    PaddyB Eccentric enthusiast

     
  10. FrankPlantagenet

    FrankPlantagenet New Member

     
  11. peter1234

    peter1234 Member

    I'm reading this with interest.A violent reign.
    What we need is a major hoard to be discovered.
     
  12. PaddyB

    PaddyB Eccentric enthusiast

    There was a hoard found at Prestwich in 1972 - only 65 coins so didn't really add a great many to the pool. (My coin is supposed to come from that group.)

    See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prestwich - this wiki page mentions the hoard under the "History" heading.

    If you want light reading on the period - the Brother Cadfael series of medieval whodunnits written under the name Ellis Peters are very entertaining.
     
  13. Assur

    Assur Junior Member

    Another two very important hoards about Stephen are the Beauvais Hoard in the 1980's and the Pimprez Hoard in 2002. 151 pennies of the Anarchy and 72 Stephen pennies were discovered respectively. Not enough to decrease the market prices.
     
  14. Lon Chaney

    Lon Chaney Well-Known Member

    Why is the DELCA mint mysterious? It hasn't been linked to a known place?
     
  15. PaddyB

    PaddyB Eccentric enthusiast

    Yes - just that - no records have been found to indicate where the DELCA Mint was located. There are a number of mints of that period that are unlocated, and others where the mint is only presumed.
     
  16. kaosleeroy108

    kaosleeroy108 The Mahayana Tea Shop & hobby center

    Have never had one so I cannot help you. But can tell you if its real and it may be. Its worth about 80 dollars you should send it. To ngc
     
  17. Assur

    Assur Junior Member

    Hehe, I don't question its authenticity at all. My question only focuses the possible distribution of its mint. And I don't think I'll send it to NGC someday because they are not familliar with such coins. Another important reason is that slabbing hammered coins is very strange IMO.
    BTW, this penny worths many times of 80 dollars, haha, which you can get a right answer from any serious collectors of British hammered coins.

    Assur
     
  18. Assur

    Assur Junior Member

    None has any idea what the mint DELCA can be. Derby has been suggested but with no confidence. And Dunstable is also discussed but there is still no proof.

    Assur
     
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