Guides/Grading World Coins

Log in or Sign up to hide this ad.

Sometimes. I have seen Italian coin guides from the early 1960s where the relative values are WAY off. In particular, rare coins valued at very low multiples of common coins, so that an early 20th century 5 Lire is only supposed to be worth ten times the same issue as a 2 Lire. And who knows, maybe those were accurate numbers relative to one another back then. At the time I was more fascinated with transistor radios and matchbox cars than coins so I have no personal experience on that. I realize auction recods exist from back then, but since the prices realized have no bearing on what a coin is worth today, tracking down the information isn't worth the effort in my opinion. All that said, the hobby owes an enormous debt of gratitude to Krause. Had the original Standard Catalog of World Coins never been published, the hobby as we know it would be a shell of what it has come to be.

 

I'm interested in putting together some foreign sets and I need a reference. The Internet...well...has its uses but I'd still like a physical reference. Will be working on the UK, Korea, and Iceland.

 

So you don't use catalog values and you don't use prices realized on eBay to determine the value of a coin. Good for you. What exactly am I supposed to be losing out on?

 

Not really. Case in point, I purchased the Eliasberg specimen of the 1938 Egypt 100 Piastres (NGC MS62) from Northeast Numismatic about a year ago for $595 and immediately tossed my own PCGS AU58 specimen on eBay where it fetched $1075 from a collector in Kuwait. You'll have to explain to me how I lost out on that deal aside from upgrading for free and pocketing nearly 500 bucks in the process.

 

I agree. PrinceofWaldo, you yourself said you bought the coin for $595, and I am assuming you thought that a fair price. Whether you realized $100 or $1000 for the coin you put on Ebay, does that change your opinion on whether the $595 you spent was fair or not? Would you have been mad if it only went for $100?

I was just the underbidder on a book on Ebay yesterday. Its one of the most desired ancient coin books there is, and it went for $225. Go to ABEbooks, a book dealer, or any "normal" place to buy this book and the price will START at $500. Another example is I won about 8 Kushanshah coins yesterday. Some are quite nice VF's, and the price for each was $8. These coins in VF are $40 and up all day long at any dealer you will ever talk to.

Ebay is an auction site, where things can go terribly good or bad for the sellers. The examples I gave were where the sellers did not do well for them unfortunately. Your example is where the seller did exceptionally well. In both cases I do not believe the market has moved, I believe is shows the idiosyncracies of a short notice, little publicized auction like an Ebay auction is. This is why I still buy on Ebay even though 90+% of it is either grossly overpiced BIN or junk in the ancients areas. There are still good material there, and sometimes the prices are well below market. BUT, if I get lucky and buy a $40 coin for $8, I will not delude myself and believe the market for these has crashed and are only worth $8 today. Also, if a coin I know is worth about $200, (because I can go to dealers I know and buy it for that), goes for $450 on Ebay, I simply view that as an uninformed buyer overpaying. I don't think my examples of that same coin is now worth $450.

Just my opinion.

 

Thanks. I had only ever seen the hard copies, and those are pricey as a set.

 

All of that assumes there is some magical all-knowing valuation on items that is not being realized or is being over-realized at any given moment. Guess it comes down to the old adage, do markets make opinions or do opinions make markets? I will go with the former on that. Never the less, markets do behave in a predicable way. Prices always move in a generalized trend within a given venue, they are not totally random. There are aberrations, and a lot of that can be explained if examined closely. ie a seller in China with an auction closing at 4:00AM on a Tuesday with a feedback profile that is lousy, will, in most instances, not realize the same price for the exact same coin as someone closing an auction at 9:00 PM on a Sunday night, selling from the US and with a 100% feedback score. So, you can say that reputation plays into it. But that is about it. Do agree with you on the BIN and other noise on the venue, which taken as a whole make eBay less efficient than it once was. As for being deluded about the value of a coin crashing from $40 to $8 it pays to remember Keynes observation that markets can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent. Which serves as a cautionary tale or warning to anyone tempted to buy low and sell high in quanity. But when there are obvious price differentials between venues, to not capitalize on them is a missed opportunity regardless of opinions as to what a coin is really worth. It's worth what it is worth in that venue and that is enough information to make decisions on.

 

I would fully agree IF Ebay was the only place to buy. However, in my examples I posted, I can buy that book from 10 sellers TODAY if I wished to buy it. However, the cheapest price it could be purchased for would be $500. Similarly, I would wager the coin you sold for over $1000 could be purchased, (similar grade), for more like $500 TODAY if someone wanted to own it.

If those things are true, just how much validity does an Ebay sale have as the basis for "market pricing". Its a data point, but if you can buy a certain coin over and over again for much cheaper from a dealer, (and there are MANY coins I know of that this is true for), than from Ebay, I simply do not believe that the "Ebay price" of a coin is truly indicative of its "market price". I would relate it more to HSN pricing. HSN will sell a BU morgan, (heck, thousands at a shot), for $100. Does that mean every low grade BU morgan in existence is now magically worth $100? Does what someone overpays on HSN change the "market price" for a coin?

I know Ebay and HSN are not the same, and its a little unfair comparison, but the principal is similar. In both cases I simply view the person buying it as overpaying for the coin, and if they turn around the next day to sell they will most likely lose money.

Like I said, just my opinion on it. I do believe Ebay IS a data point that needs to be considered, just like traditional dealers, Vcoins, and other sources nowadays. Like I said earlier, I try to consider all sources, and then judge the "market price" to be the lowest price of continued sales.

Another example would be Greenland coins. These might sell for $10 from a traditional dealer, but sell for like $30 on Ebay. Both might be consistent sales. In my view, as long as I can continue to buy for $10 from dealers, that is the "market price", not the $30 Ebay price. However, a smart seller will recognize this and sell on Ebay. I view your sales similarly sir.

 

This is a handy little book describing coins of the UK.

IMO you should first get a copy of the 1900-2000 Kause catalog. It is available hardcopy (like a phone book) and also on disc.

 

Thank you for the suggestion Collect89 - think I'll hold off on the British Coins until next year though. And the Krause - I'm all over that. I haven't bought one yet, I see there will be a 2014 out soon. Hopefully they don't leave any major countries out - a lot of the reviews of the current version report the absence of Spain and China. It's very likely I may end up with some coins from Spain or China.

 

I am a "book guy" and this is what I do. You want them for the knowledge, not pricing, so no need to buy the latest editions. I usually get the latest edition I can find for around $10 or so.

 

Here is a 1900-2000 5-year-old Krause on sale for $2.65 plus $3.95 shipping.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/2007-Standa...765?pt=US_Nonfiction_Book&hash=item43b6a9699d

If you spend $25 you can get a 2011 version of the 1900-2000 Krause book on Ebay. You may also be able to purchase a copy from a dealer at a coin show. (This is what I typically do).

All my Krause books include all the countries including Spain & China. You may find a few coins missing or wrongly listed. However, all the countries should be there. :smile

 

Thanks everyone - that's a good tip!

 

What kind of information you need to know about Icelandic coins My Friend Siggi and me are both Icelandic and know about every thing thier is to know about Icelandic coins. You can PM me if you like.

 

Thanks! I will keep you in mind!