Scary Counterfeit PCGS Holder

From what I see, the top barcode, there's little "peaks" on the top of each black bar in the barcode, i.e. the ink "runs" because either there's too much deposited by the head or the paper is not good quality. This is more common in inkjet printers - high quality laser/thermal printers are usually much more crisp in their edge definitions.

 

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So, the counterfeit slab maker needs to invest $300 in a laser printer? That is reassuring.

 

^ Or print it at work

I see it now when i zoomed those images', thanks.

 

On all the slabs in my shop that I have checked none have these dark spots on the St.gaudens part of the hologram.

Im surprised that they got the small 'trust seal" lettering to show up well but couldnt get the ink sharpness on the barcode.

 

Did you register it or does someone else have it in the registry.
[TABLE="width: 100%"]

[TABLE="class: CertVerification, width: 728"]
[TR="bgcolor: white"]
[TD="class: label, bgcolor: #F1F6FA"]Cert Verification #:
06000973
[TR="class: rowone, bgcolor: white"]
[TD="class: label, bgcolor: #F1F6FA"]PCGS Coin #:[/TD]
7180
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: white"]
[TD="class: label, bgcolor: #F1F6FA"]Date, mintmark:[/TD]
1887-S
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: white"]
[TD="class: label, bgcolor: #F1F6FA"]Denomination:[/TD]
$1
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: white"]
[TD="class: label, bgcolor: #F1F6FA"]Country:[/TD]
The United States of America
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: white"]
[TD="class: label, bgcolor: #F1F6FA"]Grade:[/TD]
MS65
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: white"]
[TD="class: label, bgcolor: #F1F6FA"]Mintage:[/TD]
1,771,000
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: white"]
[TD="class: label, bgcolor: #F1F6FA"]PCGS Price Guide[SUP]SM[/SUP] Value:[/TD]
$2,450
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: white"]
[TD="class: label, bgcolor: #F1F6FA"]Holder Type:[/TD]
Standard
[/TR]
[TR="bgcolor: white"]
[TD="class: label, bgcolor: #F1F6FA"]Population:[/TD]
310
[/TR]
[/TABLE]
[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]


Auction Appearances of This Coin

None known

Current PCGS Registry Sets

This cert is currently in a user's private set registry inventory.

 

I have not regiestered it. I have already seen photos of 1 other piece with this same cert number and it was definitely not this coin.

 

You might want to contact Don Willis at PCGS they may want to pursue legal action on this.

 

I'm fairly sure they know about this piece already. It's slowly floating around a circle of dealers locally for inspection. It's origins were on eBay.

 

I'm interested in Condor's comments.

 

I can understand them not wanting to return a fake holder but I thought the industry standard was to return the coin with a message saying it was not genuine. What leads you to believe they would infact, destroy the possibly fake coin?

 

Because it's not the coin that is not genuine. It's the slab. The coin is a genuine piece... just NOT an MS65... this coin was likely cracked out of a 64 or even a 63 holder.

They would most likely crack it out of the counterfeit slab and return the raw coin to the current owner.

 

That is scary--Books is right--that coin takes a big jump in higher condition. One look at the Morgan, and it isn't remotely close to a 65--looks like a 63 to me. The holder would pass inspection for most people--I agree that the bar code looks primitively printed, but once again, that is hard to notice. As regards the hologram, all it would take is cracking out an old hologram from another legitimate holder, and putting it all together. It is sometimes said that 5-10% of the slabs out there are counterfeit, and the implications for serious condition-oriented collectors is major.

 

This could be legit seal they could have carefully removed it from a real slab. From what i recall one schemes' going on that is rumored in panda forums is , sending or buying a real graded coin breaking the slab and copying the details and putting a fake or lower grade coin in its place and selling it (and in the mean time sending back the real coin to be graded again).

 

This slab is indeed scary and would fool many people. Matt: If you had posted the slab in another context (ie. not mentioning issues of authenticity), I am convinced that nobody on this forum would have questioned it. Not sure how the TPGs can combat this type of forgery without it becoming too cost prohibitive. TC

 

they will have to continually improve their design to prevent people from forging counterfit slabs. look at how the bep has continued to add more and more security to the dollar bill. if it can be made; it can be copied. if they continue to improve their design it will make it much harder to fake.

 

Whats going to happen to all those poor collectors who don't know how to look at coins and decide if they're real or not because they depend on slabs to do all the work for them? Guess they can't rely on slabs anymore to verify genuine coins and grade. I almost feel sorry for them.
Guy

 

We will have to see slabs in hand to verify authenticity lol send it into someone to verify authenticity. Should send the slab into CAC lol

 

Umm... If we all know it's counterfeit, why is it on eBay right now?

... Or is this the REAL coin that the China men stole that cert number from? :scratch:

Matt, are you "verypq" on eBay?


http://www.ebay.com/itm/Dazzling-cartwheel-shine-1887-S-1-MORGAN-PCGS-MS65-San-Francisco-Silver-Dollar-/221123765439?pt=Coins_US_Individual&hash=item337c00e4bf

-Brian

 

The problem is that the new generation of Morgans coming in now most dealers can't even catch the counterfeits unless they specialize in them.
At least for now this quality of fake slab is rare most are still pretty obvious.

 

Nope our eBay name is indycoindealer. The piece I have shown is not for sale. The coin however is in my safe but I am not the owner... And the owner is NOT verypq.

The coin Barry Stuppler shows is a different piece and may be the original coin... I believe that he knows of this piece as well.