Another one to report.

2 major differences. First, unmarked copies are known as counterfeits. Except for Chine, I believe they are illegal throughout the rest of the world. And the German silver and plated bullion are not copies of coins and plainly marked. Selling bullion of most any form is completely legal.

Secondly, selling counterfeits is against eBay rules. In fact, if you don't think they qualify as counterfeit, selling replica coins is against eBay rules. Selling bullion marked as plated (or even unmarked) or German silver is completely within eBay rules.

So we have illegal versus legal and we have against the rules versus within the rules. Somehow they do not compare IMO.

 

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Well I know it may be legal to sell them, but that doesn't mean it's right. Neither are those rotten 9/11 "coins" that were only produced to prey on people. Illegal? No. Immoral? Yes. Very.

I forget the name of the law, but there is also a law out there that says that if you see a person about to walk in front of a moving vehicle, and were able to act but do nothing to save that person, and they are killed, you cannot be charged criminally for your inaction. (This goes for any given situation... The choking person 2 tables down may have gotten spit-up on your new suit so you calmly finish your veal as they gasp their last... A blind man is headed straight toward a sudden drop-off; just enough time to grab your smartphone and catch it on video... etc.)

I think that's pretty **** poor. Maybe I'm a bit biased; as a worker in nursing, I am required to respond to a trauma I may run across. I find laws protecting the above desribed behavior reprehensible, in just the same manor as those who hide behind the non-existance of governance in order to peddle their white metal crap.

People said, maybe in this thread even, that 'more laws are not needed' or 'more government involvement isn't good' etc. And this is true. But the more this stuff is marketed, sold, and at one point or another complained about, the greater the guarantee will be that regulation isn't that far away. JMHO.

It isn't illegal... yet. But hey, neither were any of those synthetic drugs we keep hearing about in the news. Until they were news. Then they were regulated. People used to be able to buy stuff in the gas station that today is a controlled substance and can only be located through a RX and a trip to the pharmacy.

 

You can't legislate morality.

 

To play it safe, I will bite my tongue on that comment

 

The opposite of the 'law of inaction' (for lack of it's actual name) as described above, is a form of moral legislation in my state called the Good Samaritan Act.

I don't know how long this 'bullion' has been being sold but chances are that as people get wise to their ignorance they will make many, many squeaky wheels. The grease will come in the form of regulation, for better or worse, because of items like this flooding the bullion market. It may take some time, but I think the time is coming when these people ruin it for everyone

 

And my understanding is that the Good Samaritan Act simply keeps the person trying to do a good act from litigation rather than requiring action. For example you think someone is having a heart attack and you apply chest compressions and when they survive they sue you for breaking their ribs.

 

Correct. There is also something there to protect you if you stand by and watch a person choke to death. Just because it's not illegal... yet... doesn't necessarily mean it's the right thing to do.

 

Yes, I agree and would hope that I had the courage or expertise to intervene if necessary. I really hate that show on TV that sets up a situation in public on camera to see how people would respond. Often you might not want to interefere because it is not your business. Very uncomfortable.

 

Guys, really?

What does good Samaritan laws have to do with the topic and discussion of this thread?

 

Great job y'all...they can run but they can't hide....

Can't buy y'all a beer but I can give y'all a big.....

 

Education has NOTHING to do with it. Just because YOU have not seen anyone collect such things, this means nothing. I remember reading about some guy who collects toenail clippings... why on earth would someone do this? Its nasty, but its also their life, not mine. The point is that just because YOU have not experienced something, do not assume it does not happen.

Well, this is where "education" could come into play, right? There are countless reputable avenues that could be taken by someone wishing to buy metals, but they CHOOSE - for whatever reason, but often price - to buy from risky sources. In this day and age, anyone from anywhere can easily and quickly find a solid source for metals, especially since in most cases they are already ONLINE. Even if silver dropped back to $5toz, certain people would still buy these "bars" because they could get them for $4.

So which is it? Either it "did exist" or was "unheard of". With all due respect, Detecto, ten years ago you were a ten year old kid, so please do not tell me how bad or good things were then.. I lived through it without having a bedtime.

Your opinion of yourself is what has little basis in reality. Stop acting the hotshot and stop assuming that everyone on this forum is a fool. The only thing such comments do is show who the fool really is. Do you really think all of us simple idiots who had no concept of anything until you came to our rescue? Remember what I said about giving others the same courtesy/consideration that you expect us to give you? How can anyone here take you seriously when you basically just called us a bunch of morons?

One of these days, Detecto, you will have real responsibility if life and will realize how foolish a crusade this was. When you have to spend your days supporting a family and spend your nights worrying about your children, you may finally realize what takes precedence in this life. Unless coins/metals are what you rely on to put food on the table or a roof over your head, they will be no more than an afterthought... something to enjoy. While some of your points may be valid and your intentions noble, when all is said and done you will have changed nothing.

 

"You can't legislate morality." -rickmp

Good Samaritan Act was brought up for 2 reasons:

1. To clarify what I meant by 'law of inaction,' of which I forget the correct name, and
2. To show Moral Legislation has already occured.

Then Good Samaritan Act itself needed a bit of clarifiction. That's how things go on these discussion forums.

Post 122 and 125 are my on topic points.

To summarize: While I realize these products are not illegal to sell, much as the way it's not illegal to let someone die, their very existance/the act in itself is immoral, or "wrong." Unfettered sale of things made to deceive the uneducated will someday lead to the death of unregulated bullion trading; just as inaction results in legalized 'accidental' and 'natural' deaths to people every year.

 

How are 'Good Samaritan' laws moral? You still have the right to do the immoral thing and walk away.
What might be moral for one might be immoral for another.

 

Read up on it here: http://definitions.uslegal.com/g/good-samaritans/

Then revert to Post #132 for end of thread.

 

I know what the good samaritan laws are. I asked you to explain how they are moral legislation.

 

REPLY TO POST # 135



*sigh Okay.

"Under the good samaritan laws which grant immunity, if the good samaritan makes an error while rendering emergency medical care, he or she cannot be held legally liable for damages in court. However, two conditions usually must be met; 1) the aid must be given at the scene of the emergency, and. 2) if the "volunteer" has other motives, such as the hope of being paid a fee or reward, then the law will not apply."

"Any person who in good faith renders emergency care, without renumeration or expectation of renumeration, at the scene of an accident or emergency to the victim of the accident or emergency shall not be liable for any civil damages resulting from the persons acts or omission, except for such damages as may result from the persons gross negligence or wanton acts or omissions." -from above link (post #134)


"Our citizen-heros, our physicians and first responders should not have to worry about a lawsuit that would devastate their families when they respond to an emergency as a rescuer" --- from http://www.goodsamaritanlawproject.com/aboutus.html

GSA is there to positively affect American morality by encouraging not just trained first responders but also 'citizen-heroes' to help others in need.

"Concerned individuals and organizations like the American Heart Association are searching for methods to encourage bystanders to respond to emergencies..."

Read more at Suite101: Bystanders, the Good Samaritan Law, and Fear of being Sued | Suite101.com http://suite101.com/article/bystand...-and-fear-of-being-sued-a260168#ixzz217BY0Fo9

If that isn't legislation in an attempt to bring American morality back to what it once was I don't know what is. JMHO.

 

That is typically our reaction whilst reading one of your threads.

Tim, it's members like you that make a lot of people prefer other forums over CT. The fact that we are even trying to help you at this point is phenomenal.

Lots of good advice in this thread and many of your other threads. All I can do now is suggest you re-read them all.

 

Again, that is not legislated morality. Legislated morality would be a law REQUIRING someone to render aid.
I understand the law. Explaining it to me again and again does not answer my original question.

Morality is not the same for all people. Honor killings are moral to some but immoral to others.

I stand by my statement that you cannot legislate morality.

 

Just answer this, please: Do you believe that production and sale of these items will ultimately benefit, detract from, or have no effect on the future of non-regulated bullion trading?