Teletrade is still using hidden reserves!

Teletrade's search feature sucks, too.

 

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20 Years ago, auction firms would list an item SOLD if it was sold to the consignor as a buyback or reserve. People considered THAT misleading, because it could be used to manipulate price guides that a coin had actually sold at that price level, when it was actually the owner buying it back at a high price. Therefore, it was deemed more fair to list all buybacks/reserves as UNSOLD.

 

In case you can't intepret what has changed, which is apparent, Teletrade simply stated that there would no longer be any incremental bidding (by the system) up to the seller's buy back bid. A seller's buy back becomes the opening bid. The olkd method would have the system "bid" up to the sellers buyback bid making it "appear" that someone was actually bidding on the lot.

"........All bidding will now open at the opening bid or one bid increment below the "reserve" to increase bidding transparency."

They did not say they were eliminating "reserves".

They did not say that they were starting all auction lots at $0.99.
Sellers still have the option (wisely) of setting a starting bid on the coins they consign.

Might I suggest that you only participate in the Tuesday No Reserve Teletrade Auctions? That way, you can actually view the true bids.

 

Teletrade notifies you as to what Auction and Lot your coins have been assigned to.

As a seller, it then becomes your responsibility to go to that Auction and enter your Buyback bids which basically are entered like any other bid. In essence, you, as seller, get first bid rights on all coins which you consign.

IF, a seller does not enter a buyback bid, then bidding begins at $1 and then oncrement according to "max bids" placed by bidders.

Doing this is just as risky as selling your coins on eBay at a .99 cent start.

 

Sellers cannot "see" maximum bids any more than buyers can "see" maximum bids. Maximum bids are reported to sellers exactly the same way as buyers by entering the "See Max Bids" for a particular Auction. Only your "max bids" are reported back.

 

For one, DLRC tells people their reserve, and yes, I consider hidden reserves sneaky. Additionally, teletrade does not tell you if the reserve is hit or not, and other auction houses (eBay for instance) do.

Phantom bids are the fake incremental bids that occur on Teletrade when in fact there are no humans bidding. Teletrade has been doing this for as long as I've been following them -- since the early 2000's.

Those are two examples of "sneakiness", one of which is unique to Teletrade (phantom bidding), and the other is not done by all other auction houses as you suggest (hidden reserves).

Another example of sneakiness, and this is done by other auction houses but is much more prevalent at Teletrade, is the auctioning of Spectrum/Teletrade-owned coins. Essentially, it is used as a retail outlet masquerading as an auction.

Frankly, the entire market is a bit skewed/sneaky, but Teletrade is sneakier than other auctions, IMO.

 

In real auctions (I have been an auctioneer for 20 years) the opening bid is almost always very low "to get things started" and the auctioneer raises the floor bids on behalf of the consignor up to the reserve. Read the fine print of almost any auction...here for example...

http://www.graysauctioneers.com/terms.asp

9. Some Lots in the Sale may be subject to a confidential reserve below which the Lot will not be sold. The reserve will not exceed the low estimate of the Lot. The Auctioneer may open the bidding on any Lot below the reserve by placing a bid on behalf of the consignor and may continue to bid on behalf of the consignor up to the amount of the reserve. This may be done by placing consecutive bids or by placing bids in response to other bidders.

 

Hidden reserves are a valid strategy in any negotiation. Any time you reveal the "minimum you will accept," often that is all you will get.

 

Two points, Frank...

First, just because the industry does it widely doesn't make it right.

Second, an auction is not a negotiation between two parties, it's an open auction with multiple bidders. Furthermore, DLRC and now Teletrade have no issue with revealing reserves.

Given you are up to your elbows in an industry I look at with a jaundiced eye, I do not expect you to agree with me, but I did want to respond to your posts with my perspective....Mike

 

Whatever happened to personal responsibility?
If one is too lazy to read the rules, or one does take the time to read them but fails to completely comprehend them, one should not participate in the auction. If one has no knowledge of how an auction works and gets burned in that auction, it's not the fault of the auction house.
I am of the opinion that the blame in this particular situation does not in any way possible fall on Teletrade, but on the OP, as the OP failed to educate himself before bidding.

 

So they don't have email?

Spends hours searching terms but can't take the time to email and actually ask what happened before filing a BBB complaint.

This is true and if you read the terms of sale from any of the major auction houses they will say that they do this and that they reserve the right to bid on lots in the auction.

 

make all the arguments you want in TT's favor- I just do not like them and will not use them. I have tried them in the past and I always felt ripped off. I just do not get that same feeling with Heritage.

 

You say tomayto and I say tomahto.

 

I went to an accredited auction school, follow all laws regarding auctions (which go back to Colonial America), and have 6 hours a year in continuing education, and am licensed and tested by my state. Your opinion that "it's not right" is a pretty weak argument for smearing an entire profession.

 

maybe I am a little harsh- and I am sure that it was my fault- but after postage and fees I ended up with a coin that was not worth it- I never felt that way with Heritage.

 

Before Teletrade changed to the current setup, a phantom bid was one placed by the system.

Example:

I consign a coin that I value at $750. I do not want to sell it below $600. After the coin was put into a specific aution, I logon and place my buyback bid. (A buyback bid "could" be referred to as a sellers reserve.) If my buyback bid is $600, the old Teletrade would place a "starting bid" at say $300 when the auction opened for bidding. Then, unless someone bid higher than the $600 reserve, the system would bid behind the scenes upto that $600 mark.

Those could be referred to as "phantom bids" since nobody is really bidding but if a person were watching the auction, it would appear as if someone was actually bidding.

That policy has been done away with and instead, the listing begins at 1 increment below the sellers buyback so that the next bid received, equals the sellers buyback amount.

 

Well thats an interesting statement since Heritage charges the exact same buyers fee's (15%) as Teletrade but Heritage has a much steeper minimum ($8.00 vs $14.00). Shipping Charges are similar for both venues whom also charge the same for State Sales Tax where it's applicable.

Perhaps the feelings are simply jaded due to the inaccurate smearing that Teletrade seems to get on a regular basis by buyers who fail to read and comprehend the Terms and Conditions for bidding? (Ah hem Detec.......)