Useless CAC sticker

Perhaps you can make an offer on the coin and offer to give them back the sticker?

 

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Two to three fold with a green bean, huh? Just another uninformed, baseless comment, aye BUnc?

 

While all four of your obverse images of the coins appear PQ,( IMHO) I would also like to see the reverse, in order to venture an opinion. However, whatever the answer it is just that, an opinion. For the record, as for the subject coin of the thread, based on my experience with this series, I happen to agree with Ruben. The grade assigned and approved by CAC is suspect. IMHO
As for my reply to Lehigh's comments, come on, it was somewhat comical, as well as to a good point. It would be helpful if your responses are written in a manner that one not need to quickly grab their thesaurus and search every other word.

 

Some people are so in need of attention, they will do virtually anything to get it. He is so busy looking up words in his thesaurus that he forgot to read the part of this thread where I clearly stated he was on my ignore list. Unfortunately, you quoted him. I see thesaurus boy has reverted back to plain English although still condescending. But since you quoted him, I do have some thoughts

1) No numismatist worth his salt would ask people to grade a coin simply by showing one side of the coin.
2) The photos are all from different sources and of varying quality. If they are his coins, why can't he photograph them properly. Surely someone with a multi million dollar collection would have the resources to accomplish that.
3) He posted 4 different coins from 3 different mints. The striking standard across mints is very different. Only the "P" mint 1917's are routinely found with full heads. The Denver coins are 3-5X more rare, and the San Francisco coins are 3-5X more rare than the Denver in full head.
4) He asked for "guesses" about which coins have a CAC sticker. They would have to be guesses since in order to evaluate an incremental grade, knowing the assigned grade would be a requisite. Furthermore, we would have to know that every coin was indeed submitted to the CAC but only two stickered.
5) He claims that he owned GEM grade FH Quarters with 3 different grades. None of the coins in the photos are MS67 which means that one of them has to be MS64. Last time I checked, MS64 was not a gem grade. Furthermore, at least one of these coins is not full head.
6) I see no educational value in this exercise.

Top Left (1917-S): MS65 CAC The surfaces are very clean and the strike is typical. Luster would make the difference between MS65 and MS66.
Top Right (1917-D): MS65 FH The surfaces are clean of marks but are badly spotted. The head is full and the weak shield rivets are common on the "D" mint 1917's. My GUESS is that the CAC did not like the spotting.
Bottom Left (1917): MS64 This coin has the worst surfaces of the 4 coins and the photo is over exposed which could be hiding even more flaws. It is certainly making it difficult to judge the FH merit of the coin.
Bottom Right (1917): MS66 FH CAC Easily the best coin of the group. Superb strike & surfaces!


BTW, The only other member of this forum who collects gem grade SLQ's to my knowledge is rld14 who hasn't posted since March 2011. I wonder why he stopped posting?????

 

Bill is around and he is not alone


And actually, he is more of a cherry picker. there are few people wealthy enough to own say, 50 SLQ FH66's or even 68's

Ruben

 

I am aware, I didn't even make it to double digits before I tapped out!

 

there you go. I brought and sold several and have none. I brought them largely to take pictures

Ruben

 

What are your thoughts on the photos posted?

 

which ones? When someone posts 4 or more images I tend to just numb out. It takes a lot of concentration to grade these things, especially with dinky subpar images. the only person I know who can do it endlessly is Doug

 

Yeah the only one I'd look at is the one on the lower right, which is a MS66 FH. The one on the upper right is might be a 63FH. it has a very good head but is missing the slit on the left leg. The upper left looks to me as a MS64 but it is hard to tell some of the details through the toning. It has a moderate head, but a great shield and a so so leg. It is a strange coin. It is rare for the sheild to be that clear and everything else to be so weak. So I could be misgrading it by one or two grades down, depending on the reverse (obviously). The one on the lower left has been dipped Its sharp but a weak head. It has a hit on the knee but the photo is completely bleeched out and reverse is cirtical on this coin. It can be anywhere from a 66 to a 63.

 

Oh BTW - i have no idea what CAC does...none.

 

From their website:

WHAT THE CAC STICKER MEANS:
• Verified. Your coin has been verified as meeting the standard for strict quality within its grade.
• Guaranteed. CAC stands behind our verification by making markets in most actively traded coins.
THE CAC STICKER IS BACKED BY EXPERIENCE.
CAC was founded by leading members of the numismatic community, including John Albanese, a respected authority on coin grading and the rare coin market.

 

i still have no idea what CAC does...none. One thing I know they don't do is grade coins.

 

Yes you do...but just for the sake of arguement I'll try and explain it. They take a coin graded and slabbed by another company (experts) and they judge it for themselves (also experts). If they feel it meets or exceeds the grade on the slab they certify it as such. Therefore, a CAC sticker means 2 groups of experts have looked at the coin and graded it...not just one.

 

No that is not what they do. if they did that they would assign a grade and slab it. When someone gives a second opinion in the Dental field, do they start with a new examination or they just say... the other dentist did a Plus Job, a regular Job, or a bad job.

 

CAC KEEPING STRICT STANDARDS

http://www.caccoin.com/cac-in-the-news/cac-keeping-strict-standards/

.

 

They do another exam...which is exactly what CAC does. They look at the coin and they grade it. However, the service they offer does not include a new slab. It is simply a second opinion. Their "grading" is seen by the sticker they give. If in their expert opinion, they come to the same conclusion as the TPG, it gets a green sticker. If the TPG was too strict in their opinion...it gets gold. If the coin is overgraded, it gets nothing.

IMHO, the way they do it is better than reslabbing. By stickering the slab, there are two independent opinions as to the grade of the coin. The first is the TPG's slabbed grade and the second is their sticker. If CAC was to replace the slab with their own...that initial TPG's opinion would be lost.

Also, FYI...The other dentist would never say the previous doctor did a bad job. That is considered extremely unprofessional.

 

Yup, and so would a positive judgment or a neutral one.

Ruben

 

There is nothing wrong with telling someone they have had nice work done. But, you never throw another professional under the bus.

 

But again, since no one answered my post #157, WHAT grading system are they verifying? The slabs grading system, ANA, or their own?

Sorry if I am a stickler about this, but with so many different grading systems around, saying "verifying the grade" means nothing unless you know what system is being used.