I know these are probably stupid/novice questions but here goes: When I see an individual proof coin for sale, did that coin have to come from a broken up set? And if so, how does the fact that so many sets are broken up impact the value of sets remaining intact? Finally, when they publish (like in redbook) the number of proof sets minted, does that mean how many were minted or actually sold? Thanks for your input.
What a great first question!!! I wish I could answer I can tell you I just broke up an '88 set cause the lens was cracked. (Made good use of them for my Dansco's) For the most part I can't bring myself to busting them open!!! But I to wonder where these guys are getting full rolls of proofs?????
Yes, proof coins are only sold in sets and the number reported (which isn't always accurate, btw) represents the total number of sets sold. Sets that go unsold are destroyed...at least that's the way I understand it. Great question! ...and :welcome: to CT!
I've seen proofs wind up as demonetized waffled coins so I would say yes, they sell the metal for scrap. I don't think it's recycled, per se, as in the same metal becomes coins again...
Dealers buy large quantities of the proof sets and submit them for grading in bulk quantities. As a rule, they specify a minimum grade desired (PF69 or PF70), and any that do not meet the minimum are returned to the dealer uncertified. The dealer will then opt to either sell them individually, in rolls or even put together date sets or type sets in display cases to sell. Chris
I have been wondering this same question for years. It would apply to uncirculated mint sets also. Maybe some time in the distant future, there will be years of mint/proof sets that will become rarities from all the dismantled sets. 2009 would be a good guess, as tons of uncirculated satin mint sets were separated and sold on ebay, due to low mintages in the circulating versions of those coins.
The cents aren't reused and probably not the dollar metal but the nickels and clad are probably still reused to make coins. The nickels are melted to make the cladding layers and the clad are remixed to make either nickels or cladding. There's a steady evolution in such things but it's likely at least the nickels are still recycled since they're prett convenient for it. Since 1936 regular proofs have been issued only in sets but there are individual proof commems and such that are sometimes (usually) sold singly. Older proof coins were available singly. Lots of proof sets get busted up every year to supply the demand for proof singles. Some are destroyed in fires and flood or broken up for high grade coins. With mintages in the millions there's no danger of running out of any in the near future. However some dates like the '68 have been destroyed in significant numbers and a large demand for intact sets could force prices higher. This might also apply to the '92- date silver sets someday and almost any other dates. I wouldn't hold my breath waiting but these are attractive sets with some pretty coins in them.
The mint has no waste of any material used for the production of coins, whether they're for the collector sets, or business strikes. Everything is recycled.
I would just comment that older mint/proof sets are getting VERY hard to find with nice coins. The sets are everywhere, but you pull out the slab to see the coins, and they are all clouded, blurry, hazy, even what appears to be stained with liquid (spots)... I remember they used to be cameo, bright, clean, etc... So either all the good sets have been picked away, or these WERE the good sets, and have just been in mint packaging too long. This tells me that sets with PQ coins should already be PQ priced. But sets are always going to be easy to find, in our lifetimes, just GOOD ones are already very rare.
There's a lot of truth here. A lot of good sets have gone bad and some dates are typically or always bad. It's worse with the mint sets but the proof sets aren't that far behind. There has been a little cherry picking going on so a lot of what's left is picked over. Most collectors don't realize just how tough a collection of nice attractive mint and proof sets can be. Now the older silver mint and proof sets are being destroyed in large numbers again. When the economy strenghtens the demand will improve and the supply is not going to be ample for the first time ever. This wouldn't be an especial problem except that the source for singles won't be there so the demand on sets could be large. There was never a bottomless pit for any of these and now with as many as 70% of the mint sets destroyed and up to 40% of proof sets gone the few tarnished stragglers just might not cut the mustard for collectors.
A very good thread from a newbie. Since I have a plethora of mint and proof sets, I'm hoping that they will go up in price in the future. I'm still seeing many proof and mint sets at local auctions from the 70's and 80's at incredibly low prices. It is getting hard to find 71 and 87 mint sets probably because so many are busted open to get the 71-D, 87-P, and 87-D half dollars. They are starting to increase in value. The collapse of the value of the 1999 clad and silver proof sets was also discouraging. They are now selling at prices that are half the price of a couple of year's ago.
I think you will eventually be right on the '87 mint set, but it almost looks as if the mint anticipated people would be breaking up sets by the mintage records. As for the '99 proof sets dropping in value, it's a good thing for guys like me that have not purchased it yet, but are planning to. I'm going to gamble it will drop a bit more yet, and then hopefully scoop 'em up!
The 1936 to 1942 coins were also sold as individual proof coins. Sure you could buy all five coins and get a "set" but they didn't have to be purchased that way. (Look in the Redbook at the proof mintages for these dates for each of the denominations and you will find that the mintages of the coins for each year/denomination are all different.) Starting with the 1950 coins they were only available as sets. The fact that they have been busting these sets up for YEARS and sets like the late 60's are still right around issue price almost fifty years later should tell you something about how many people actually collect these sets.
