Pricey toned Morgan...

This is not a ebay auction, This is a Heritage auction which I can assure you that they do not shill bid with 100 percent confidence. I also would not be surprised in the least if there is more than two players in this auction but we can be sure that there is atleast 2. Like I have already stated earlier, coin collecting can be split up into 2 parts. The larger part is looking to make profit and live and die by the price guide. The minority is looking to add unique pieces to there collection and dont really care what the price guide says. So in retrospect I would say that if the minority is driving a "$300" coin up to $4000 the toning market is as healthy as its ever been

 

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Everyone's price tag for happiness is different. The scenario you describe could be right: there could be two enthusiastic bidders willing to plunk down a month's salary (or whatever) to own the most fantastic toner they ever will. But the high bidder could also very easily be a dealer who happens to have a wealthy client who basically gave him carte blanche to find the most spectacular toners, price being no object. There were huge bids placed on several other monster-toned Morgans at the same time this one received a huge bid—may have been the same dealer. I see on Heritage (for example) all the time coins bid up to astronomical levels, only to be re-listed two auctions later at which they go for 1/3 the price. I don't think the collectors doing that are crying in their soup over their poor decisions.

I'm not arguing anybody's point, just saying, really, that there are all kinds of collectors out there, some who cherish each new coin they buy (that would be me and probably most of us here) and others who have money they just don't know what to do with.

 

I see your point and agree 100 percent. Do I think its fair? No! I would love to know that a middle class hard working man is going to win this coin and cherish it forever. However, that scenario is unlikely. Once again this is why I dont collect Morgans, with my capitol I have a heck of a time staying competitive while bidding on silver Rainbow Dimes. So trying to capture stunning Morgans would probably not be too enjoyable for me. The bidders and I have the same mindset, I just dont have the pockets they do.

 

That sounds like a great store to write about in this topic.

http://www.cointalk.com/t133915/

 

Yup.. see that now. Thanks for level setting me nicely..... You make good points. I'd still prefer getting this one with a couple grand to spare. http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=1145&Lot_No=4206

 

I think the best deal I ever got on a toner was the 83-CC, NGC MS65 No-Line Fatty, that I use for my avatar. I won it in one of Shane's auctions. I set my max bid at $1250 and won it for 1.4X CDN. I entered my bid with only 5 seconds left, so I think the previous high bidder was thinking he had a lock on it.

Chris

 

Just sharing another image of the coin.....

 

The pic is my image, it is not worked up.

 

Toned Morgans

Is it the toning or the sticker???
I always pick the toning and the strike before I look at the grade?


http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=1145&Lot_No=4205&Lot_Id_No=34005

 

Sorry, probably mis-worded there... better phrase would have been ' lit up ' vs. worked up..... most, not all, but most heavily toned coins I've see appear much duller and darker in what I'd call normal light,,, and don't really show thier color unless you blast them with light. You can see the difference in the pics heritage posted in the auction link in thier site. I've posted a franklin neon bomb in this forum before also,,, an amazing toner imo, but only under heavy light or in sunlight,,, bring it into a normally lit room and 80% of the of the color turns gray. The toning is revealed, exaggerated, or amplified, by lighting.

 

I read through this whole thread and I can appreciate another man’s opinion as much as the next guy....we are all entitled to believe what we want but I try to be a little more responsible with my statements as I understand that my finances and what I like to collect do not match that of other collectors so before I make inaccurate and insensitive comments I try to consider all view points.

#1 You made reference to neon paint and make an assumption that you could buy blast white examples and duplicate the color....if you could you would as I have heard that argument for years and to date I have never seen anyone actually do this successfully. There is a lot of money to be made so go for it!

#2 You questioned the images themselves...they're worked on or the coin is held under extreme lighting. One of the reasons this coin will sell for moon money it because that most likely is not the case. Early ‘S’ mint Morgan’s are known to have amazing luster and semi-pl surfaces so when you throw neon toning on top of that you usually get a coin with extreme pop and quality of color. I have seen hundreds of monster toners like this in hand and probably even owned a few so I believe it is wise to not make assumptions on photos unless you have seen the coin in hand...but hey that's just me lol

#3 You made comments about the high probability of there being shill bidding going on with the auctions. Yes you may have been joking but based on the rest of the negative comments you made it makes me wonder if you were truly joking. I believe there is still a solid market for these high level toners but now days there are far fewer collectors willing or able to drop $5k-$10k on common date toners but rest assured there are still buyers happy to spend their hard earned money for them.

#4 You believe there are thousands of eBay buyers readily able to drop $5k on coins if they wanted to but obviously they don't see value in dropping that kind of money on common date toners. Unless you are Nostradamus I don't see how you could even remotely validate such a statement/opinion. I can tell you that I would pay more for toners like this than most folks on the planet as I see value in them but rough economic times make that an impossibility right now. Do not mistake a lack of buyers for there being a lack of interest because that is most likely not the case. I think percentage wise there are very few coin transactions on Ebay that are $5k and above just because of the fees alone. I know dozens of dealer who simply list high price inventory on Ebay for the publicity....call it a store window if you will as a lot of eyes are on Ebay and if only one or two buyers see a coin and then make their way to the dealers website outside of Ebay then they can easily justify the listing costs.

#5 when you go to buy a car, a washer & dryer, a diamond ring....do you have to go into an unlit back room to purchase them? Being a good salesmen means highlighting an items strong points, putting plenty of light on the item so all details can be clearly seen, colors fully appreciated. When creating a 2D image of a 3D item, optimal lighting is a key component so saying you have to hold a coin under light to see the full color spectrum is kinda a no brainer? When you go to coin shows that have lamps clipped to the table so you can hold the coin up for inspection and get a good feel for the coin. It never ceases to amaze me when I sell on Ebay that every once in a while a buyer will win an amazing coin from me and then return it saying it's darker in hand......no duh lol How the heck can I image the coin if I am in a dark room without proper lighting? I get one chance to have the coin make the right first impression on a perspective buyer and having high quality fully lit images is the best any of us can achieve that goal. I have never purchased a coin and not looked at it under a light source.....never ;0

Please do not take my post above to mean in any way that I don't believe you are entitled to your opinion, I simply hope to point out that when put together from end to end...your statements/opinions are very negative and biased against monster toned coins...which perhaps is exactly how you feel.

 

Shane, In fairness, as a collector and, perhaps even more importantly, a seller of these coins, you are just as positively biased. Not that there's anything wrong with bias in either direction....Mike

 

p.s. that 80-S is a wonderful coin, IMO, and beauty (and value) is in the eye of the beholder.

 

Heck, we get so many underexposed photos posted here that I get headaches just trying to read the mintmarks. Let there be light!

Chris

 

I'd like to add a comment in a different direction, if I could. First, let me say that I love this Morgan toner and would love to own it. I just can't justify spending the money necessary to obtain it, even though I believe a market will always exist for such a beautifully toned coin. Others have made similar comments on this thread: "Like it, but not enough to spend the money."

But I wonder—and I realize I'm comparing apples to oranges—would a buyer of this Morgan consider spending as much on a painting? My point is that, if you're after rich, interesting (however you want to describe it) color, there are many nice paintings (of any style) out there for $4,000. Of course, for investment concerns, it's a whole different market, but in terms of sheer appreciation, something you'd like to enjoy regularly, why limit yourself to something an inch and a half in diameter?

And I mention paintings and not antiques or vintage autos, etc., because coins are, after all, little pictures.

 

an 8 year old girl just sold a painting for 250K...it think I would rather have the morgan...heheh

 

That's a whole different topic: paintings made by elephants, apes, various other critters, little kids, etc. That's just novelty that, once again, proves that some people don't know what to do with their money.

 

I viewed the coin in hand yesterday and think it is exquisite.

The bottom line is that each of us has our own perception of beauty and limit as to what we are willing to pay for it. And those perceptions and limits often vary greatly, from one person to another. It doesn't mean anyone is right or wrong, or smart or dumb, only that they are different in their collecting habits.

 

Well summed up.

 

interesting bought my first NGC star coin couple weeks back and paid 100$ for a common date MS-63...but personally would rather have a nice MS-68 or 5-7 MS-67s than a monster like that....still the coin is mamazing .. just think it is a little too much