Coin Grading/Authentication Services - Page 3

GradingPolicingAuthority · 01-13-2003, 02:35 PM

Apparently "Reid Goldsborough" has [removed] about the various coin grading services.

First, when he discusses PCGS, he fails to mention that they have violated numerous code of The Federal Trade Comission (FTC) regarding the paid endorsements they receive from PNG because PCGS simply just happened to be the highest bidder for this "endorsement".

Second, NGC is quilty of the same crime insofar as they have paid of the ANA (American Numismatic Association) for a like endorsement.

The problem is that neither PCGS, NGC, PNG or ANA disclose this material fact to the public, thereby misleading the public and giving the customer some sort of false security.

Third, mr. "goldborough" fails to mention that David Hall runs PCGS or also runs David Halls North American Trading, David Hall Rare Coins and others.

Fourth, [removed] fails to tell the World that SEGS grading service owners is Larry Briggs, who also owns Larry Briggs rare coins.

Fifth, TCGS grading service is not owned by coin dealer in Florida who grades his own coins. It is an independant Corp, business, location and group of persons,

Sixth, NGC's founder is John Albanese. And there is also John Albanese Numismatics and David Albanese Rare Coins. A connection there?
Of course!

Seventh, Digital Coin Grading Service (DCGS) is owned by Janette Seligman who also owns GoldTown, Inc a coin dealer.

Eight, Numistrust Corp (NTC) is owned by Kevin McNerney who also owns Island Rarities, Inc a coin dealer

Nineth, Global Cert. Services (GCS) is owned by Jeff Garrett who owns and grades coins. He also owns Mid American Rare Coin Galleries, a coin dealer.

In Summary, people like "mr. goldsborough" are apparently affilated by one of the grading services that he "endorses" because he obviously owns coins grading by those services or sells coins grading by those grading services.

The Grading Policing Authority

Reid Goldsborough · 01-13-2003, 02:59 PM

Quote:

TCGS (Twenty-first Century Grading Service)
http://members.aol.com/uscoinexch/index/welcome.html
* A service of a coin dealer in Florida who grades his own coins.

I just received word that the above is not correct. The correct URL for TCGS is http://www.tcgs.org. Their Web site indicates that there is more than one grader involved. I'll post a corrected list in another message here.

**GDJMSP** · 01-13-2003, 10:45 PM

While I will agree about a couple of points made by GradingPolicingAuthority regarding what appears to be a conflict of interest - I do not agree that NGC & PCGS fail to make it public that they receive paid endorsements from the PNG & the ANA. This fact is well known and is publicized every time the contract comes up for renewal. They even announce the amounts paid.

I have long campaigned to do away with this practice as I feel it is not in the best interest of the numismatic community. I feel that organizations like the PNG & ANA, as well as others, should endorse all of the grading companies equally. Provided the grading companies can verify that they are indeed worthy of such endorsement. Until such time - there is little else that collectors can rely on other than their own opinions and the opinions of other collectors.

evillageprowler · 01-14-2003, 11:24 AM

What an interesting thread...

I didn't realize that there are so many self-proclaimed experts of grading and the grading services. And, the lot of them seem generally to be more eager to nitpick at what others write than to deal in more substantive commentary.

Unless you're a major participant of the industry where your business activity lives or dies by the grade (e.g., if you're a crackout dealer or a professional grader for a prominent service), then I'd suggest that you not proclaim your expertise too loudly.

EVP

Jess · 01-23-2003, 04:48 PM

all of this and a buck will get u a coffee and donut at Dunkin Donuts, oops did I just endorse them. I think not I just stated a fact. :?

laz · 02-03-2003, 07:45 PM

Jess, I think it's more like $3.47 nowadays for a large coffee and a donut. :? pretty sad if you ask me.Now this thread brings up another question,is the "authorty" from Southern Florida affiliated with the notorious "AH" I know he's got a young feller working for him for his grading service,probably failed his eye test! 8) it wouldn't surprise me if they were related just as several of the ebay dealer's work for "AH" and specialize in peddling PCI and ACG graded coins. ~ Jim

ops:

**Peter T Davis** · 02-18-2003, 08:25 PM

Seems you wandered in via the MSN search where I've gotten CoinTalk in the #3 position for the keyword 'coin grading'. It's perfectly acceptible to critisize Reid on his statement regarding coin grading companies. God knows, you wouldn't be the first. However, at CoinTalk, you must do so in a respectful way. I've removed a couple of parts of your statement that I find to be disrespectful. Not that I feel Reid needs me, or anyone else, to stick up for him, but I believe it's disrespectful for the whole site for you to speak to another member in that manner.

Reid Goldsborough · 02-22-2003, 05:51 PM

Quote:

It's perfectly acceptible to critisize Reid on his statement regarding coin grading companies. God knows, you wouldn't be the first.

Actually, I've gotten very, very few criticisms about this post about the grading services, here or elsewhere. This is all mainstream stuff, as balanced as I can make it. Those doing the criticizing seem to have vested interests, to be employed by one of the services not in the mainstream or to be selling coins in their slabs. The information I included is very much in line with the results of the PNG/ICTA survey and the material, though much more limited, in the Coin Dealer Newsletter. It doesn't mean that there are no mistakes in this post, but I correct them if they're pointed out to me. And it doesn't mean that only the mainstream services are worthy of consideration by coin collectors.

A Barnes · 07-13-2003, 03:45 PM

Now I understand this grading service thing a bit.

Zman · 07-15-2003, 12:32 AM

I have seen 1925-s Buffalo nickels (which notoriously have a weak strike) graded by PCGS at MS64 and they don't look to good. I have a 1925-s Buffalo myself with nice luster and a decent strike graded by PCGS EF45. I haven't been a fan of PCGS and still aren't. I think there ego gets in the way of there grading. As other people have said grading is an opinion and I don't believe PCGS is any better than ICG or any of the top 4 or 5 grading companies. What is the reason there coins receive top dollar. I don't understand!

**Peter T Davis** · 07-15-2003, 08:28 AM

1920s Buffalo Nickels from the branch mints especially are difficult to grade due to poor strikes.

laz · 07-15-2003, 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reid Goldsborough

"GradingPolicingAuthority" above doesn't mention that he's with TCGS (Twenty-first Century Grading Service), or appears to be from his two threatening emails to me. For the record, I'm not affiliated with any grading service.

I find it rather interesting that this was the "authorities" only post, kinda hit and run. Pretty sad way to behave if you ask me,and not exactly showing the good side of grading services! ~ Jim

rottnrog · 07-17-2003, 07:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GDJMSP

A couple of points - none of the better grading companies will clean your coins. They just don't do it.

There is a company - NCS - that does offer a conservation service - and this could be thought of as cleaning. But they are not a grading company. They will however - after they have performed their service for you - submit your coin to NGC and have them grade the coin.

One other note - Rick Montgomery no longer works for PCGS - he now works for NGC.

NCS is owned by NGC, so technically they are a grading company!

Stujoe · 07-17-2003, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rottnrog

NCS is owned by NGC, so technically they are a grading company!

ANACS is owned by Amos Publishing. Does that make ANACS a magazine?

Just kidding as I would say NCS is a grading service too. Even the slab on their website says "1792 B-2 25c - XF Detail - Improper Cleaning Artificial Toning"

http://www.ncscoin.com/

I would call that grading and they call it grading too:

http://www.ncscoin.com/auth_grading/index.htm

However, they only grade problem coins and they do it technically. Really, I consider NCS to be a conservation service and the "We don't want it in our top notch slabs" division of NGC.

laz · 07-18-2003, 08:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rottnrog

NCS is owned by NGC, so technically they are a grading company!

Careful folks, rottnrog is a excapee from Error World! lol Well,things should liven up a bit now,welcome aboard Roger!! It's nice to see you on the list! ~ Jim

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