What am I missing about this 50 Kopeck?

I saw the following offer of a 1914 50 Kopek on eBay, the asking price is $400:

http://cgi.ebay.com/RUSSIAN-SILVER-...E-1914-XF_W0QQitemZ260206630977QQcmdZViewItem

A quick look at my Krause seems to tell me that this coin, even in finest possible condition is priced around $70.

Assuming good faith from the dealer, what am I overlooking about this coin?

Thanks for any advice or pointers,
Mike

 

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I agree... but as a newbie I'd like to make sure I am not overlooking some nuance. Or, perhaps he is just grossly overcharging (I double checked, it is actually $500!).

 

I would look elsewhere.

 

I agree.

The terms of sale are particularly objectionable: "If for any reason you are not completely satisfied with your purchase, you may return it in original packaging and original condition within 7 days of receipt of the merchandise for a FULL REFUND of the purchase price less S&H and 10% restocking fee. Buyer is responsible for return shipping charges."

So, if the goods are not satisfactory, you pay shipping both ways and the seller penalizes you for using your (rather limited) return privilege by keeping 10% of your "full refund" as a "restocking fee" (in this case, $49.90).

With respect to the price demanded, Krause prices for Russian coins are almost completely useless because they are hopelessly out of date. But even so, I would not consider paying the asking price for this coin even if I agreed with the grading (which I do not).

 

On that note, where would I get more recent pricing other then what is being offered on line? Is there a world coin equivalent of Coin Dealers Newsletter or Coin Values?

 

Not that I know.

Check auction prices at major dealers (Baldwin, Markov, Kuenker, M&M, UBS).

www.coinarchives.com is also worthwhile although the search function is awkward to use. Pay particular attention to when coins were auctioned because Russian coin prices, particularly for rare and/or choice coins, have been steadily climbing in recent years in terms of European currencies. The depreciation of the dollar against them has greatly magnified this effect for US buyers.

 

If you are looking at Krause, let's say it's completely outdated as Russian coins have done a good job in making a nightmare for the editors of Krause to estimate a more realistic price. I am not too sure about the rarity about that particular year but I don't remember off seeing many coins of that particular year. Do check the market for the past price.

 

1914= RARE, but $200 would be a more realistic price in that condition (although the Russian market goes up and down like a yo-yo)

 

guys!!
All he is asking is if that is a variety or something of the sort!
All he wants to know is if the coin is really worth that, and if so, for what reason.... oye

 

I think he's gotten some good answers and I haven't yet heard him complain about the replies he's received.

 

What has been going down?

 

This has been a very educational discussion for me. I know that the Krause prices are not current, but I can't imagine a coin that tops out at $70 in the most recent Krause could really have jumped to $500.

I think I learned a combination of lessons: There are thieves on eBay, and even when they put "Nice Coin!" it doesn't mean they are kindly collectors looking to share their treasures with you. And, use the price guides as sanity checks. And, alway refer to your helpful friends on CoinTalk when in doubt.

Thanks, that was $500 NOT well spent.

 

Adding to the above replies... at the last coin show I was at a dealer, knowing I collect world coins, asked me if I have any Russian coins because, quote 'those are really hot now, very high demand, the market is ...blah blah...' So this seller could be of the same opinion or who knows, maybe even the same dealer. We live in such a conflict of 'sound advice' ~ we all know 'buy low, sell high' as the way to make it through life but the trend seems to be 'it's getting high, we need to buy before it get's any higher' ... so that combined with some people's logic of 'the more it cost, the better it must be' leads to some enterprising Ebay sellers like this one posting at high reserves just to see what happens. Could also be he really doesn't want to sell it but decides 'hey, if I 'do' sell at the price I listed, I'll mourn it all the way to the bank.' Just some more answers of why it could be listed so much higher than Krause.

 

"Why not just ask?", I thought...

So I sent the following question directly to the dealer via eBay messages... let's see what comes back:

"I'm very curious about the price of this item... as far as I can tell from other sources this coin even in finest condition is valued between $100 - $200. Is this some variety or rarity that is not reflected in Krause etc.? PLEASE don't take this question for anything other then a desire to understand... I'm definately not questioning your pricing in any way, I just want to make sure I am not overlooking an important coin."

 

Apparently you didn't understand any of our posts - if you can find any of the Tsarist rubles, half ruble and quarter ruble at Krause price or even lower, good job. Otherwise, something is terribly wrong. Even counterfeited coins are going higher than Krause price so that should tell you something.

 

I understood the previous posts perfectly well. It just seems to me that the price is so far out of line that I should ask the seller... and possibly get the same answer but I'd like to hear it from him. Also, I obtained a 50 kopek, admittedly at a lower grade but not much below XF, for a fraction of this cost and pretty much in line with Krause. Maybe that dealer just didn't know the market.

 

3 thoughts come to mind.

1. Maybe you got it from a dealer who doesn't know that Russian coins (especially rare and choice Russian coins) are in demand these days. This is possible, but not probable IMHO. Lucky you if this is the case.

2. Maybe the coin is a common date in mediocre condition or has problems and is therefore difficult to sell.

3. If neither of the above, are you sure that the coin is genuine? There is a flood of fake Russian coins (and other countries as well) coming from China, many of them being sold through ebay. The quantity and variety of fakes being offered suggests to me that this is no cottage industry, but rather an organized criminal operation, possibly with the connivance of the Chinese government.

No good Russian coin sells for peanuts these days unless stolen, counterfeit or offered by a person who hasn't got a clue what he's selling.

 

Thank you all for a very enlightening discussion. I'm now concerned about the 3 - 4 coins I got on eBay at reasonable prices, even though they were pretty common 10-15-20 kopecks.

I don't think this is a question of common date, as the coin Y#58.2 is the only 50 kopeck minted in 1914. Mine is definitely is worse condition, and though I got it through a local dealer rather then eBay I'm wondering if it is fake.

But this thread has helped me pick up some key information:

- No, there is no other 1914 50 kopeck not listed in Krause that I am not aware of.

- Yes, it is entirely possible for a coin listed in Krause at $70 in UNC to be going for hundreds of dollars.

- Yes, it is important to be cautious buying Russian (and probably other) coins on eBay due to the flood of fakes offered there.

- It never hurts to ask the seller: by the way, he responded very nicely referring me to a similar coin in MS63 condition that auctioned for $1200!

Again, thanks for all the discussion on this.
Mike