Trade $ Experts- Opinions Please!

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Jack D. Young, Jun 22, 2022.

  1. Jack D. Young

    Jack D. Young Well-Known Member

    A friend believes this one is NG and has offered to send it to me for an in-hand review but I would like some opinions from the Group here!




    Last edited: Jun 22, 2022
  2. Avatar

    Guest User Guest

    to hide this ad.
  3. Randy Abercrombie

    Randy Abercrombie Supporter! Supporter

    Jack... I am a rabid hobbyist and not an expert. Personally when I look at a trade dollar, I look at Lady Liberty's hands and feet. It seems to me the counterfeiters of the world get lazy on hand and foot details. And looking at Lady Liberty's foot, this one immediately registers as fake to my eyes..... And again, I am not the expert and look forward to what the educated folks have to say.
  4. Dave Waterstraat

    Dave Waterstraat Well-Known Member

    Certainly not an expert here but the missing lower left serif of the second L in DOLLAR is a die maker of a known reverse die. If this is a counterfeit it's a good one.

    edit to add -

    edit to also add - example of the above reverse die paired with an obverse die with date placement of the OP example. -

    According to the information in the SSDC registry there were 2 obverse dies paired with this reverse die.
    Last edited: Jun 22, 2022
  5. charley

    charley Well-Known Member

    Compare to the 75S in the TD Thread below this thread.

    Jack, Apologize in advance for responding to your thread, in accordance to your previous request, but this was a little to obvious as a possible comparison to not mention it. I will not give my opinion, again per previous request.
  6. -jeffB

    -jeffB Greshams LEO Supporter

    I thought the same thing. But then I looked at several photos of graded Trade dollars, and thought the same thing about those toes, too. :(
  7. Treashunt

    Treashunt The Other Frank

    exactly what I did, and reached the same conclusion
  8. Dave Waterstraat

    Dave Waterstraat Well-Known Member

    I have to ask, what does your friend see that looks wrong?
  9. Randy Abercrombie

    Randy Abercrombie Supporter! Supporter

    This bugged me. You guys are right. The examples I looked at on the web displayed similar characteristics….. So it drove me nuts and I had to come home and make an attempt at some close up shots of my slabbed AU53. I thought that would be a fairer representation since mine has similar wear to Jacks photo.

    The foot in Jacks photo simply appears to be crude lines scratched where the toes should be. On mine there is depth to the structure of the foot. It is far more three dimensional and shows depth to the features.

    The hand on my example has four distinct fingers holding the branch. Try as I might, I can only make out three fingers on Jacks example. And again, the fingers appear far more crude than the fingers on my slabbed piece.

    Again, I preface this by emphasizing that I am a rabid hobbyist and NOT an expert at counterfeit detection. I thank the heavens that we have Jack on this forum to help keep us straight….. But I do think that I’ll stand by my previous comment. I think Jacks is counterfeit based upon the crude hand and foot details.
    MIGuy, -jeffB and halfcent1793 like this.
  10. Mark A Williams

    Mark A Williams Active Member

    A coin grading company should give you the true facts on your trade dollar. I'm no expert. Thanks for showing it to all of us.
  11. Jim Dale

    Jim Dale Well-Known Member

    Amen to you all. Like most collectors, we aren't experts, but we do have so knowledge that could get us a hint that before buying a coin that is expensive and the source is not known, I would hold off on making a major purchase. I hope that you will take care before a purchase like this one. And again, it could be a real coin...
  12. Jack D. Young

    Jack D. Young Well-Known Member

    Comments so far were "The dentils have the spark erosion texture. The fields look weird, and there are several tiny raised bumps near the letters on the reverse". And "the pitting, the "e pluribus unum" and the eagles head"...
    -jeffB likes this.
  13. Dave Waterstraat

    Dave Waterstraat Well-Known Member

    The links I posted to GC auctions appear to have the same rust pitting in the denticles so if the PCGS and NGC graded examples match this example we're looking at a rusted die or multiple examples from a spark erosion die.
    Marsden and -jeffB like this.
  14. ksparrow

    ksparrow Coin Hoarder Supporter

    Do you have a closeup of some edge reeding?
    What I don't like so far is the odd texture overall, sort of "micro-pebbly," especially on the rev dentils, and a lump on the 2nd L in DOLLAR. I'm suspicious.
  15. ksparrow

    ksparrow Coin Hoarder Supporter

    Nice research, also I see the lump on the L. The surface texture is very similar and not something I was familiar with , so now I am somewhat less suspicious of the op coin, but would still like to see an edge close up.
  16. KBBPLL

    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    Gosh, I'm stumped. It really gives me the feeling of a fake, but then there's this MS67 on Heritage. Save off the reverse image on this and the subject coin, zoom way in and compare the letters, particularly in TRADE DOLLAR. Examine all the lumps. Even some patterns in the smallest raised dots are identical. Seems like it's either legit or an amazing clone of this die.
    Marsden likes this.
  17. ifthevamzarockin

    ifthevamzarockin Well-Known Member

    I'm not a TD expert but it looks genuine to me.

    Here is one that appears to have a grainy texture.
  18. COOPER12

    COOPER12 Well-Known Member

    Coin looks authentic to me.It is A known reverse .
    Plus weight looks perfect and past the Sigma tester.
  19. Jack D. Young

    Jack D. Young Well-Known Member

  20. mbogoman

    mbogoman Active Member

    The number of fingers is correct for a Type 1 obverse, which this is. The fourth finger came along withe the Type 2 obverse in 1876.
    The coin looks authentic to me. I do see what looks like filed rims, but that may be the photo angle and lighting.
    Randy Abercrombie likes this.
  21. Jack D. Young

    Jack D. Young Well-Known Member

    Could just be the images but the eagle looks odd in comparison:

    eagle heads.jpg
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page