Looking Bad

Discussion in 'Bullion Investing' started by Mr. Coin Lover, Sep 29, 2010.

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  1. tekhen

    tekhen Member

    New days and times Coin...
    the Nixon Shock in 1971, the coinage act of 1965. To be honest these two events are one of the instances that led us to where we are today regarding PMs. I was born after these events and can't compare them to any other time in history but what I will say is the true math doesn't lie.

    Continue to print money and it will devalue.
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  3. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    Big if, as most small investors historically buy high sell low, over and over again. Small investors spend too much time listening to others and chasing returns. Anyone who can time any market will be wealthy, be it silver, nickel, or pork bellies. If someone's idea of researching investments is listening to the tv, reading posts on the internet, or getting advice from people who will make money selling you something, you will most likely lose long term. Look for assets no one talks about, ones underperforming that you believe will come back strong. That is how to make money I believe.

    As for PM's I am too worried about how much production these prices will bring onto the market long term to be a long term buyer right now.

    Just my 2 cents.
  4. Captainkirk

    Captainkirk 73 Buick Riviera owner

    I had to drive 2 hours today, and stumbled upon a talk radio station. My gosh, the paranoid Schizophrenic host almost had me scared, all the ads were for storable dehydrated food. I came home, took off my shoes and walked in the sunshine. Worrying about the future does nothing, I prefer living in the now. I may be an old hippy ostrich, but I remember y2k.
  5. Mr. Coin Lover

    Mr. Coin Lover Supporter**

    It is true this didn't just happen, took a long time. I hope we learn something out of all this as a nation that will stay with us. Like I have any other choice but to go along for the ride.
  6. Evom777

    Evom777 Make mine .999

    I`d love to hear how America is going to recover this time. Who has the crystal ball that foresees manufacturing coming back here? Or do I have it all wrong, and any minute now major companies that have sold out to China will forsake greed, and do what`s best for their fellow Americans and come back?

    Do tell Us soothsayers....will the "green jobs" save the U.S. economy? Will the U.S. lead the way in that sector? Look at other countries that have a clear understanding as to which direction they want to move in. (time will tell whether or not it works out for them) The American voter is one of the hardest animals to fathom.....We truly want it all for nothing. Do any of the prophets on here see the political tension easing anytime soon and politicians doing what`s best for Joe Blow? I don`t see it happening as long as they represent special interest. Judge them by the fruits of their labor.

    So fortune tellers......do tell how America`s rotting and decaying infrastructure is going to be rebuilt? Perhaps We can outsource those projects as well. I`d love to hear how Our kids` test scores are going to rebound? Maybe that endangered species called the "family" will make a comeback and instill values and a good work ethic in today`s youth? And how does one foresee the problems in the black community fairing in all of this?

    I know that doom and gloom has always been around, and unfortunately it sells, but at what point does one stop tossing buckets of water off the Titanic and realize that this great country will indeed sink? I`m not a pessimist so much as a realist, (but I still thank the Lord everyday for what I do have) and a historian.....and great civilizations have fallen, and they all had the same mindset...."not us, not now, not ever."

    The PMs are going to do just fine. Make mine .999.
  7. Mr. Coin Lover

    Mr. Coin Lover Supporter**

    Were you in the Rivera when you did the 2 hour drive?
  8. Mr. Coin Lover

    Mr. Coin Lover Supporter**

    I think you stated yourself very well. I'm sure practically every adult member of this forum has had the same thoughts as you. I could go on make other comments on this, but it would be way too political for here.
  9. Captainkirk

    Captainkirk 73 Buick Riviera owner

    Nope, the Truck, (4 cyl), for hauling masses of bullion. I did drive barefoot, which is legal in PA. truck.JPG
  10. Cloudsweeper99

    Cloudsweeper99 Treasure Hunter

    One possibility you have to consider is that you and others feel stressed because the controllers want everyone to feel stressed, and afraid, and compliant. You had fun in the 70s by not paying attention. The same is or could be true now. Don't worry about the debt. It isn't your debt. People in the late 60s through the 70s were extremely unhappy with Washington -- probably more than they are now. There were more demonstrations, riots and civil disobedience. There was a little thing called Watergate. The underground economy was more active. People won't do that now, probably because the pain level isn't high enough. I don't know if we will get there. I think politicians were more afraid back then, and with good reason. If they pulled some of the things that routinely go on now, it wouldn't be tolerated. People are sheep now.
  11. Cloudsweeper99

    Cloudsweeper99 Treasure Hunter

    Of course the economy will recover. But the conditions aren't in place yet. To have a recovery you need a pent-up demand for goods, attractive profit margins for business, easy access to equity and debt capital, and a deflated debt structure. We don't have any of these. It doesn't take a crystal ball. The market will work its magic over time. All things considered, things were much worse in the 30s and 70s than they are now. Don't be fooled by politicians or businessmen picking the next industry that will save the economy. That sort of economic planning won't work. It never worked, anyplace. Politicians were and always will be crooked. Whatever they say is irrelevant, and people should ignore them. They don't lead the parade. They find a parade to walk in front of. Kid's test scores are not relevant. Kids succeed because they are well educated and motivated to succeed, not because they can take tests or go into fields that are pre-approved by the political class. You indicate correctly that infrastructure needs to be rebuilt. It will be. When Joe Blow stops waiting for someone to tell him what to do, where to go, what to think, and just says the heck with all of them, I'm just going to do it myself, then things will change. And they will. And many people will make fortunes from it.
  12. Evom777

    Evom777 Make mine .999

    @Cloudsweeper99. I do agree with You about how the sheep need to ignore the politicians. However they do play a part in policy making, some more extreme than others. Take a small endeavor that was started by the late Richard Nixon....the E.P.A.....Love them or hate them, We can not deny their impact on business and Our society. We`re talking about just one drop in the bucket that is a major factor.

    In a prior post You stated that Mr. Coin Lover should not worry about the debt because it`s not His. Be that as it may, it brings me to my next point.....the debt belongs to Our children and grandchildren.....and this is where their education, test scores and overall work ethic DO matter. I don`t think they truly comprehend what they`re inheriting. YOU however are a very educated and motivated individual, but unfortunately You are starting to become the exception. Our society is slowly gravitating towards one that relies on others instead of oneself. (and it started a long time ago)

    One can not deny the despair of the early to mid 70s, with the oil crisis looming over Us like an eternal black cloud. The U.S. was forced to react and it did, the Alaskan pipeline was finally completed in 77, and major oil discoveries in the North Sea saw more oil rigs built in the late 70s-early 80s than ever before. We truly rose up to the challenge. I`d like to say We can do the same now, but everything gets bogged down and very little gets done. (too many fingers in too many pies) Again this comes down to politics. All the initiative and money will not get You past Uncle Sam unless You grease His wheels. I`d love to see Joe Blow start filling in some potholes on His own accord, but We all know how long that would last....soon He`d be downtown in the "tank" with the real criminals for not having the right permit. Things are just too bass ackwards in the U.S. these days. : )
  13. fatima

    fatima Junior Member

    The problems in the 1970s were tactical ones related to shortages of energy, namely oil. The problems we have now are far different and the equivalence argument, that somehow we will be OK because we made it through the 1970s, is a fallacy. It should be noted that many of the lessons learned by those of the 1970s have been mostly forgotten in modern America.

    However the real issue behind the current economic crisis is simply this. We have been gutting our industrial base and sending it overseas for the sole purpose of increasing the bonuses and payouts to the executives of the corporations making these decisions. Industry is a huge component of wealth creation in a society. While this was going on over the last 30 years, it was replaced by false wealth created by the endless printing of paper that ended up in housing and stocks. It was a huge ponzi that depended on new suckers coming into the market, to cover the speculation already there. i.e. People willing to buy homes they had no chance of paying off, because they thought they could sell out for a profit.

    Like all ponzi schemes, it comes crashing down once the new suckers stop entering the market. This happened in 2007 when our old friend oil, gave people a reminder of the 1970s. When the average price of gasoline exceeded $4/gallon, and Americans, who had forgotten the 1970s as I said earlier, could no longer afford to drive their gas guzzling SUVs, and that was the beginning of the end. It makes me laugh, to hear it repeated endlessly and accepted by the public, that we can have a sustainable economy based on consumption. ("consumers are the backbone of the American economy...") Successful economies are based on production, not consumption.

    The real solutions to the current economic crisis are painful and serious and this is why things are not getting better. The solutions require those in power to give up that power and this doesn't come easily. So instead we get a lot of false arguments as to what is wrong. Anyone seriously investing in PM bullion who doesn't know this, should take the time to figure this out. In regards to politics, yes unfortunately it is very political because the government has decided, by its actions, that the free market can't be left to sort out this mess and hence it along with the old men running the Federal Reserve, are picking the winners and losers now.

    The end game isn't going to be pretty.
  14. De Orc

    De Orc Well-Known Member

    Guy's sorry to rain on your parade but if you want to talk about Bullion prices fine but the forum rules state quite clearly NO POLITICS so please do follow that simple rule otherwise some Ogre (possibly Doug himself) will pounce and close this down :D
  15. Mr. Coin Lover

    Mr. Coin Lover Supporter**

    You are right, I knew this was going to come eventually. PM discussion can easily become political. But, I also think reading about the politics concerning PMs are important to read.
  16. GDJMSP

    GDJMSP Numismatist Moderator

    Fine, then go to the PRWE forum and talk about them to your heart's content. Just don't do it here !
  17. tekhen

    tekhen Member

    too bring it back to bullion...

    As a whole, the predicament will be bad for most. Those who are bullion 'investors' will find themselves in a good position.
    The Mint has stopped minting 2010 bullion Au Buffalos with no clear info on 2011. Will Eagles follow suit?

    Even with the highs we are seeing, now is still a time to slowly enter the market...slow steady hands during the highs.
    I am sure many thought like I, "Au will not reach $1,000 for many more years". Look at it now.

    The fundamentals for PM are not as most experts tout. Ag and Au can and should still be seen as money. As long as our current state of fiat usage is debt driven PMs will reign for some time.
  18. medoraman

    medoraman Supporter! Supporter

    But that doesn't jive with the facts. Our fiat money, (and the entire world is fiat money), has always been debt driven and this has not made PM's go up for the last 50 years as your scenario would suggest it should. I agree PM's can go up some, I have no way of predicting the market, but to say it will go up as long as fiat money exists or is driven by debt doesn't really related to what we know has happened in the past.
  19. Cloudsweeper99

    Cloudsweeper99 Treasure Hunter

    Things will get done when conditions become untolerable. We aren't there yet. I know it seems impossible now, but after it happens everyone will wonder why it took so long because the solutions will come so easily. The federal government will eventually make themselves irrelevant with their own debt and inability to pay. Washington can't conceive of limits on debt and spending, but they are out there and getting closer every day.
  20. Mr. Coin Lover

    Mr. Coin Lover Supporter**

    All that has been stated here makes me feel glad I do have the silver I have. I have no plans to sell, but I'm glad I have it.
  21. Cloudsweeper99

    Cloudsweeper99 Treasure Hunter

    You left out Vietnam, Watergate, financial disintermediation, Arab/Israeli war, foreign debt defaults, high rates of inflation and unemployment, crashing bond and stock markets, falling dollar, numerous domestic terrorism incidents, USSR nuclear threat, imminent Warsaw Pact threat to Europe, and a commerical real estate crash. People think that things are different now and somehow more difficult than the 70s, but this isn't really true. The details are a bit different now, as they always are, but overall the problems of today are certainly no worse than the 1970s except that now there are numerous internet bloggers telling everyone how bad things are everyday. And the sheep buy it.
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