Deceitful ebay sellers - wheat pennies

Discussion in 'US Coins Forum' started by Kelly Langford, May 30, 2022.

  1. Treashunt

    Treashunt The Other Frank

    Heck, I have about $50+ in wheaties that I have dug over the years [metal detecting]

    I have them rolled and they are really unsearched, I know that I looked for S VDB's and 31S's

    No luck, but the rest are just there in a heavy box.

    I love to sell them, for a fair price + postage.

    [Attn: Mods: Not an offer to buy or sell]
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    KBBPLL Well-Known Member

    So, "sorted" but not "searched." You could push that to any extreme you wanted to. Like advertising a roll of unsearched 1909 cents - hey, nobody looked for a mint mark or a VDB, just the date! Fine line between deceptive and fraudulent I guess.
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  4. Michael K

    Michael K Well-Known Member

    Plus they are almost all going to be environmentally damaged. That's the problem with finding old coins that have been buried for many years. You have to hit a key date to have anything. Gold holds up better tarnish wise.
    But the soil, water, pollution etc. reacts with the copper and trashes a lot of those old copper pennies.
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  5. imrich

    imrich Supporter! Supporter

    You sure are correct about long term storage of Copper cents.

    After 70+ years of collecting and storing semi-keys rolls of cents, I have some well-struck rolls of Green coins.

    I also have similar condition of contaminated/oxidized black Silver coins.

    Although I've developed proprietary means of partial contaminated reversal, the processes are time/effort prohibitive.

    I occasionally have a good laugh when I hear of the means for many postings long term storage approach.

    Although it isn't perfect for eliminating atmospheric deterioration, I found a slabbed coin will generally reduce surface deterioration effects.

    Generally, I've found that only a purged oxygen/air, vacuum sealed housing will eliminate deterioration.

    Expecting pristine rolls of wheat cents at virtually melt cost, wrapped in paper, is probably a little naive.

    How much did it cost to make a penny before 1982?

    So for the past 30 years, pennies have been made with an alloy comprised of 97.5% zinc and 2.5% copper, but pennies minted before 1982 are 95% copper and 5% zinc. The price of copper has more than quadrupled over the past 10 years. So a penny produced before 1982 is worth 2.2 cents based on the metal it contains. Feb 23, 2012

    Last edited: Jun 1, 2022
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  6. They wouldn't be able too. That's precisely the point.
  7. Dealers like this are sadly a dime a dozen on Ebay now. It sucks. They blocked you so you couldn't make anymore purchases and leave negative feedback. Negative feedback hurts sellers, but doesn't stop people from buying from them. Its a way to weed out the ones who know they are full of poo. lol
  8. Thank you for the info. I don't expect pristine pennies. That is indeed naïve. I would like to see less sellers like this succeed. Coin collecting is fun and I hate to think how many people who try get into it get burned by sellers like this. It's up to each party involved to do their homework. I just want to help people avoid this if I can. I doubt I will make very much change but This is an amazing hobby and I absolutely love it. I want to help others enjoy it as well.
    imrich likes this.
  9. Yep: That "fine line" is a big ole crack that sellers like this slip through.
  10. Update: I received the pennies today. I made a video of me going through all of them. I was pretty spot on with my earlier prediction. These guys aren't original anymore. The rolls they were in are the exact same rolls I used today to roll up all the coins I search. Stamping and all. That was the first clue that I was about to ask for a refund. I put on my gloves and got to it.
    The first roll: 1903 Indian head on bottom, one brilliant 1958 but deteriorated die wheat and absolute junk on the others. PMD, ED, curiously colored as if cleaning had taken place. Nothing under 1940.
    Roll 2: 1904 indian Almost exactly the same as roll one but there was one steel in it along with the brilliant 1958.
    Roll 3: 1903 Indian head penny and barely legible coins above 1940.

    I contacted the seller and asked for the refund mentioning that these rolls were clearly staged and searched. The buyer said, "Sir (I'm a ma'am) the coins are completely unsearched. I'm sorry you're upset that you didn't get that lucky coin. But none of the coins are in bad condition."
    (Everything in quotes is copied and pasted from our back and forth)
    Me: ( *tells my dog to hold my "beverage" and watch this. She didn't care lol) "It's not about finding a million dollar penny and I never mentioned a million dollar penny. We both know you wouldn't list it on Ebay had you found it in the rolls you carefully crafted for this listing. The issue is that you staged these coins, sold/are selling them for a premium when they are worth face value. There is no such thing as an unsearched roll. Further more you could have put in your listing "Unsearched by you" but I don't even believe that is true because the rolls they are in I can buy today and actually use today to reroll pennies I search through. I don't have a fancy roller like you apparently do, but I can tell you that pennies like this don't come in rolls like that and have not been searched. I can also say that one person having 300+ "truly sealed" rolls set up the same way is very unlikely. I would like a refund, please."
    Seller: "Sir you can ask me politely if you were not happy but now you were making assumptions the rolls come from a estate unsearched they are sealed. and honestly you were the first person that ever complained about these pennies....and you were honestly very rude I understand you are unhappy because you didn't get the million dollar coin you wanted. But I am willing to work with you and satisfy you if you were unhappy. Thank you (seller supposed name- probably carefully crafted too)"
    Me: (* devours Little Debbie Oatmeal cream pie) "I was very polite when I asked for the refund. I then told you what I thought when you tried to brush me off, saying I am mad about not getting the million dollar penny I was looking for. I am sorry if that seemed rude. No one wants to be called a liar by someone they don't know or someone they do for that matter. I, however believe you knowingly set these coins up. You are even using red flag words like "they came from Estate". Everything about this transaction is based on misleading so I can only assume that everything you are doing is misleading. Sure they are sealed. That I will give you. I am leaning towards the fact that you sealed them before you searched them. Do you have a picture of the receipt from the estate sale you got these from showing you bought 300+ rolls of pennies with Indian head enders?" If you do, I will leave this alone and keep the pennies. I will even buy from you again should I feel the need to spend 12.50 on a shiny 1958 wheat penny. The fact remains that it is your responsibility as a seller to guarantee the words you are listing. All you did was guarantee that you searched the rolls by stating that there are p,d,s wheat pennies... another thing you couldn't guarantee unless you searched them before crafting the rolls. Honestly, you do have 3 neutral reviews stating the same thing I am trying to tell you now. You only have one negative review mentioning they are complete garbage. That is likely the one you were unable to get removed. You will need to log into all your other accounts, make some buys and leave yourself some good reviews because my feedback will not help you either. I find it highly unlikely that your positive reviews were not also crafted by you. I do not want this to escalate further with you. I will talk with Ebay from here on out about my refund. Thank you. Unless you want to send me the receipt proving that these pennies came from an estate sale, of course."

    I waited about 1 hour and nothing. Soooo I contacted Ebay. I had a return label sent to me from them before I got off the phone. They reported the seller to the higher ups.(not sure how that will really help but I took the step anyway) Once tracking shows it arrived to the seller, I get my refund.

    I have a video that I can hopefully share to others who see these sellers and think a little harder before buying.

    I left a neutral feedback with a buyer's beware that will likely be removed if the seller tries hard enough. I gave him 5 stars for nice packaging, 5 stars for quick shipping, 3 stars for communication, and 1 star for item description. They didn't have an option for deceitful seller. He even got the same coin rolls he uses back and I placed the indian heads back on the end as well. SMH

    Will I go through all of that again to prove a point? Probably not. There is nothing fun about accusing someone of being a cheat. I stand by the fact that the seller knew exactly what he was doing. E-bay stood by their guarantee. Maybe the seller will be reprimanded. The goal was to have proof to share with others and get my money back. Mission accomplished.

    Now I have a fresh box of bank pennies to look through. I can reroll and return these anytime I want. lol As always, I am glad to be a part of this community and thank everyone for their input and shared experiences.

    I am including a picture of the coins I received. I didn't put them under the scope but these do not look like they are worth more than face value to me. I spread out the ones you could tell. These are also the pictures I sent to the seller to initiate return. Some of them are in good condition. None of them are worth the money he asked for. But he gets it because he is misleading. They may be worth more in melt value. This is also a tricky aspect of it because people who don't see nice coins on the daily tend to focus on the fact that they don't have this coin and accept this as a valid sale. If this seller would have been honest, I would have added them to my jar of wheats, but he was dishonest. IMG_20220604_181921 (1).jpg IMG_20220604_181951.jpg IMG_20220604_181958.jpg
  11. steve westermeier

    steve westermeier Cancer sucks!

    Bottom line, never buy, look or even give them the time of day. Been a scam for ever!
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