yes, they are extremely scarce. They were made to decide what to do in 1965. I guess you could call them patterns. or not....
They sold a 1964 SMS set Heritage in Jan. They are very costly!! :eating: Cent PCGS MS66 $7187 http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=1136&Lot_No=370 Nickel PCGS MS67 $2,300 http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=1136&Lot_No=607 Dime PCGS MS67 $3220 http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=1136&Lot_No=826 Quarter PCGS MS67 $6,0375 http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=1136&Lot_No=2693 Half-Dollar PCGS MS67 $16,100 http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=1136&Lot_No=2793
Anyone know the history of them? Were they offered to the public - if, not how did they get out? How many were "released"?
Below is an informational article written by Jaime Hernandez at PCGS. http://www.pcgs.com/articles/article_view.chtml?artid=5334&universeid=313&type=1
Thanks, great article. But, I'm not sure exactly what it's saying. Have all known examples come from the fomer mint director's estate? Have any been found in regular mint sets or rolls? Any mint records of melting them?
Assuming that the purchaser of the original estate knew what they were I would expect that none ended up in circulation however that does not mean that none are in circulation. The only sure method of making a determination on these coins would be through US Mint records. So far, none have been found but thats not to say that these don;t exist. Someday, it'll all come out in the wash but until then there will always be unanswered questions. As for any boeing found in regular US Moint sets, I don't know for sure but I doubt it.
No SMSes were produced in 1964, only regular mint sets and proofs. A few matte MS-67s are always produced.
There are many different theories on why the 1964 SMS coins were produced. These coins could have been produced as prototypes for the 1965 to 1967 SMS coins. The 1964 SMS coins could have also been produced as introductory pieces, possibly even intended to include a 1964-D Peace dollar. Furthermore, it is believed these SMS coins came into existence somehow through the involvement of Eva Adams, U.S. Mint Director at the time. After Eva Adams passed away, her estate was sold off and well-recognized dealer and auctioneer Lester Merkin is believed to have bought many of the coins from her estate. Lester Merkin's collection would then be sold in a Stack's auction in the early 1990s, including some, if not all, of the known 1964 SMS coins. Recently, a complete set of these compelling coins was submitted to PCGS for grading. Viewing some of these intriguing and eye-rewarding coins is definitely one of the great benefits of having thousands of coins pass though our graders' hands every single day. Today, many experts believe there are anywhere from 20 to 50 sets in existence in all grades combined, making these coins very scarce. Many of the 1964 SMS coins could have also been lost, damaged or even tossed aside since their mysterious status was only somewhat solved by early 1993, almost 30 years after they were initially produced.
To make a statement like this.........I don't think you've been paying attention since these do exist and have been well documented.
It's possible he didn't read the thread but was only responding the the original post/title and he didn't know about the 64 SMS. (Which frankly I'm not convinced about myself.)
Please note: Not a single SPECIAL MINT SET was issued dated 1964. NOT a ONE. The coins mentioned were never in sets. The 1965 "special" mint sets (SMS) were no different than the 1964 regular mint sets. The Nickels and Pennies were indistinguishable. The 1966 and '67 sets were more prooflike and were put in a different case. These might be considered "prooflike". There seem to be a few dozen prooflike coins dates 1964, but to call them SMS is misleading as they were NEVER issued in sets or were ever part of same. To repeat, there were NO SMS sets ever issued in 1964.
eric, while your point is technically correct, the discussion here is pertaining to specimen strike 1964 coins. These coins were not issued in any set, but they do, in fact, exist. they are not proof-like, they have are specimen coins, much like most pattern strikes. There is an important difference between them and business strikes and for this reason the cents and nickels are distinguishable from the 1964 Mint Set coins.
You are correct. The US Mint never issued a 1964 SMS "Set" but the coins do in fact exist. Whether or not they were actually in packaged sets when they were discovered I suppose can never be proven but the coins themselves do exist. Each of the Kennedy Half Dollars have the same die characteristics and each of the Major TPG's recognize the coins for what they are. SMS coins.
eric - do the 1894-S dimes exist ? Do the 1913 Liberty nickels exist ? Do any of the Sacky/SQ mules exist ? Do any 1965, '66, and '67 dimes, quarters & halves struck in silver exist ? The answer to all is yes, they do exist. Were any ever issued ? Are there any mint records that say they exist ? The answer is no, none were ever issued and there are no mint records that say they exist. But yet we know for an absolute fact they do exist. They are real. And you are 100% correct, there never were any 1964 SMS sets ever issued. But - we know for an absolute fact that 1964 SMS coins do exist. They were the trial pieces struck by the mint for the upcoming 1965 SMS sets. They were struck with the same dies that were going to be used in 1965 - only they were dated 1964. The coins are real, the coins are SMS coins.