Discussion in 'Error Coins' started by Jesse P, Mar 16, 2010.
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And the point is????
I think someone else who is more knowledgable will chime in.
I find on this site that I get some really good opinions and some really bad ones. I bought a 1909 s VDB and posted it last year. More thought it was fake than thought it was real including some high profile dealers (I had it slabbed and it was real). One thing I never get is folks who lack confidence that they are correct
I have been nice but also tying my best to give you some direction as I did already earler on the 1970-P small date. I gave you more than four paragraghs of very good direction because I know what I'm talking about.
You can't on the one hand post something then decide you do not like the (in this case perceived) attitude because they may be giving you the best advice for the situation at the time.
On this coin you posted a photo and said something about "trust" being wiped out but no other questions. Are we supposed to guess what you may be needing or requesting. I could have assumed you wanted to know if the coin is weakly struck or struck through grease or what? I have no idea many times what in the world you are wanting - if just posting with nothing else needed say so. So what if trust is weakly struck - is that what your wanting to know or are you just going to post photo after photo with vague directions for what you may be seeking or needing.
Before you can get help from anyone you need to be concise about what you are needing or wanting. If you are wanting to learn doubled dies or errors your going to have to man up and learn to learn.
Your never going to understand these varieties and errors your posting with such little attention to the clearity of your posts.
It is possible I'm too frank often but it's because I take this seriously and I know what I know and I have worked very hard to get where I am - I just don't know often what you may be wanting???
If to play around and go from post to post at least be honest and say so then we can take it for what it's worth.
If you want to really learn you may get candid, frank, blunt, comments but rarely will these be far off base and they will help you if you can learn to be open and have some direction with your inquirys.
Second, the "harsh" commentary. I understand both sides; that the questions need to be clear and concise and that the verbiage used is quite blunt, perhaps even rude. That being said, I personally believe the commentary was too harsh. Further, I could easily argue that the response "and the point is???" is just as vague and problematic as the OP.
There are ways to help people, and help them help themselves, without being this frank. I think/hope BHP's mindset leans more to teaching rather than telling; which, I can appreciate.
I think that you will find this is true everywhere. It can be quite hard to tell a real from a fake or error from damage, at times, when you have the coin in hand let alone looking at images.
It is always correct and good to be nice when possible but it is impossible to help someone that may appear not to know what even they may want or need. How can you do that?
With very new people the correct and good, nice approach serves a purpose. When after a time it is required that folks learn to learn.
If we don't do that it becomes a waste of time as far as learning or teaching goes.
If asked for, knolwedge at it's best is given and kept - if your not seeking more knowledge then so be it. Just let us know what you want in the first place or at least after awhile.
I just don't know what to make out of vague discriptions with photo after photo especially when this is information you should, by this time, already be learning on your own, has been answered 18 times before, and in the big scheem of things minor to begin with and you should know this at some point.
Peoples motives are hard to understand at times but sooner or later you have to either get in the game or watch the game.
Watching is nice, learning is tough. Watching is easy, learning is not.
What do you want to do?
BRAVO. I myself am a novice, but within a couple months of starting, it was evident that I had to research and read to learn. You can ask a million questions but you MUST educate yourself to really better yourself. Once an individual has done the homework and research themselves it will make a world of difference when you do find an error/variety and post it knowing what it is. This is why the pros on here are where they are. READ and STUDY
Jesse P, here's my take on it:
This forum is like playing "Who wants to be a millionaire". Once you've polled the audience, phoned a friend and used your 50/50, you're on your own. After that, you MIGHT get a "Buy a book" response, if at all.
Go buy a book, learn it all, then come back and ask questions. But, if you learn it all, you wouldn't have any questions, now would you? My posts have slowly become few and far between, because I get frustrated with being ignored. I have a genuine desire to learn, I have ordered books and am still waiting for the first one to arrive. I'm sure some of these pros get tired of answering the same questions over and over, but think of where our nation would be if our teachers got sick of teaching multiplication and division "over and over". I guess I could go back and read every post since 2002 and see my question answered somewhere, and I do try to search before posting.
In the meantime, I have searched maybe a thousand coins, and now I have a pile that I'd like answers to, but am afraid to post here because I end up hitting refresh for hours with no response. So, now I post at a more "newbie" friendly site.
Take my advice, find a forum where you can ask these questions, get the answers you seek, and when you can "p*** with the big boys" come back here and "step up to the trough". I still like to read here because there is a plethora of information and truly do respect the pros opinions, just not the lack of tolerance for those of us trying to learn.
You were told in another thread to only post "what matters". Well, personally, I'm still new enough that I think it's really cool to find a nice die crack, or a well placed gouge, or a die clash. I LIKE taking the time to really examine a coin, and who knows, maybe you will find something that's been lying dormant for decades (ask Ziggy). I'm still in the discovery stage and I hope I don't ever get to the point where I'm going through thousands of coins a minute trying to find one that I can "flip" for a profit.
Just my two cents, but this is how this forum makes me feel.
You find a coin with a little something on it and post it to learn. That's ok for awhile but most everything you've found can be easily explained with some foot work in your books to begin with as minor die errors.
If you guys would put more effort into knowing your dies, or knowing the type or class of doubling like the ones that are in that Cherry Pickers or whatever book and spend your time looking for that coin you would have more respect and be finding (sooner or later) something meaningful.
Hear it is one more time: 99% out of a hundred times we know our dies and thennnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnnn look for the coins. Not the other way around. We don't look at a coin then go to the book. If we did that we would still be in the dark ages. There are thousands of little things on coins and they are not what we are looking for. So why spend time stopping and asking about easily (after sometime) explainable minor errors. If you want respect earn respect by showing us what you are learning and "not what your not learning".
I want to find that coin in the book not the coin that's not in the book!
Zzyzzyth: you hot the nail on th head... Good for you!
(You can expect a PM from me in regards to the site you mentioned).
A quick comment about the perceived "insults" and obvious drama....
Insults are much like opinions,( which are just like a+#holes)...everybody has one, and even then they generally stink..leave the insults outside...
Drama: Save the drama for yer mama... ('Nuff said.)
www.coppercoins.com for Lincolns.
That is a heck of a reference. The guys over there do some great work. It's definitely a labor of love over there.
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