Another Lion Dollar Newp

Maybe a book, or two?
These Daalder's are some neat looking coins.

 

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For a reference I would contact Jean Elsen. He and his sons have
been very helpful over the years. Their command of the English
language is top notch.
numismatique@elsen.eu

 

And the shipping prices are top ones! 77 euro for 4 coins inside Europe! Another friend paid 70 euro for 2! I find it outrageous!

 

I was referring to the reference books. Not coins.

 

I totally got it, I was just underlying the fact that they’re shipping service is way too expensive!

 

Here's another LD that I photographed today. I spend a lot of time trying to get the best resolution, but I'm usually not satisfied with the results, so if fiddle around a lot with adjustments through Photoshop.

This is a a lion daalder from Overijssel (TRANS), 1699, another late date. Lion daalders from the 1630's through the 1650's are relatively easy to obtain, particularly from 1647 through 1650. The same is true for the 1576 and 1589 issues, with one exception - the 1589 Zeeland lion daalder is extremely rare. I was lucky to be able to obtain one through a Roma Numismatics auction last year. I will try to photograph that coin tomorrow.

Getting back to the Overijssel coin, the wide flan that characterizes lion daalders of this period is present (44mm), as is the often poorly prepared flan and crude strike. Davenport lists this date as rare.

Dav. 4861

27.27 grams

 

Great discussion, and nice looking coins. Most I see appear to have been obviously cleaned. Here's a screenshot of one I posted a while back.

 

I've dealt with Elsen for 20+ years. Bought books and catalogues and coins from
them. Never paid more than 15 Euros for shipping.

 

That's a very nice coin, minted during the early years of Holland's war against Spain, a war that would last until 1648.

Lion daalders were produced with .750 silver, generally speaking, as you noted, but sometimes the amount of silver was even lower, producing coins weighing 26 grams or less. It seems that certain liberties were taken from time to time at the mints to debase these coins, compared to the more consistent, higher standards for the ducatoons (silver riders), rijksdaalders, and silver ducats.

 

For me it's the most i've ever paid for shipping,ever! 77 euro and delivered after 3 weeks with Fedex! My friend paid 70 euro from Belgium to Czech Republic!

 

Here are a few more lion daalders that I photographed today.

The first is a very rare Zeeland lion daalder of 1589. Later dates do exist for this mint, in the late 1590s, but the 1589 date rarely comes up bidding or on dealers' websites.

The daalders from Holland for 1589 show up regularly, as do dates for the other mints in the 1590s. I have never seen this coin in the years that I was collecting this series. The Krause guide on the Davenport catalog crowns lists this date for Zeeland at a value of $600 in VF, and that was in 1982. Of course, this might be considered something of a niche coin, with a limited collector base, but I am glad to have it in the collection.

Dav. 8869

27.13 grams




The next coin, from Holland, is a very scarce date, 1586. It was purchased in the same Roma E-Sale that included the 1589 Zeeland daalder.

Dav. 8838

27.57 grams




The third coin, from 1631, is from Gelderland. This date is scarce. It also has what I call a "lazy 3" in the date, possibly due to a punch that lacked the upper bar of the 3.

Dav. 4849

26.40 grams




The final coin comes from Friesland. The lion daalders from this mint generally tend to be quite crudely produced, most due to pretty bad strikes. This coin, dated 1604, has plenty of crudeness, but it is also quite high grade, especially for this mint. Additionally, there are some deposits speckled on both sides.

Dav. 4852

27.46 grams

 

Here is another, I bought it raw and was a bit concerned about authenticity, so I included it in a group to ICG.
The seller called it minted in Overijssel, but it came back as Utrecht. I haven't delved into these much, can't opine either way.

 

That is a very nice lion daalder!

The seller was correct. TRAN stands for the province of Overijssel or "across the IJessl", a tributary of the Rhine River.

Utrecht lion daalder obverse legends end with TRA or TRAI

Overijssel lion daalders' obverse legends end with either TRAN or TRANS.

Here's a link to a webpage on the lion daalder other contemporary Dutch coinage. There's also a link within it to another page on the mints.

https://coins.nd.edu/colcoin/colcoinintros/Lion-Dollar.intro.html

If you look at my imitation lion daalder, 1638, on the first page, you'll see the legend ending in TRAN, but in this case the TRAN is an abbreviation for Transylvania. It is a rare coin and very distinctive, especially for collectors with some experience with these coin.

There is also a Transylvanian imitation lion daalder that another CT member, PaulTudor, posted before mine, on page one. That coin's obverse legend ends with TRA, but it is also from Transylvania, the same date as my coin, 1638. Again, as with my coin, the style is very distinctive and very different from the Dutch lion daalders. It too is a very rare coin.

 

Here are 5 1/2 more of mine:
1601 Holland

1641 Zwolle
1648 Kampen

1649 Utrecht

1651 Gelderland

1597 Holland 1/2 Daalder

 

Very nice examples!

Are you collecting by mint/date or by mint only?

 

I'm going to start with mint, then maybe design type. We'll see where it takes me after I get a nice Overijssel, West Friesland, Friesland, and Zeeland. From what I gather, Friesland will be the toughest of those four. I don't expect Zutphen to come along very often or be something budgetarily in line with the others.

 

Yes, Friesland is a little more tougher to locate. The early dates, say from 1606 to 1617 tend to be more available than later dates.

Once you have examples of the provincial and regional mints, there are also the city mints of Campen, Zwolle and Deventer. That last city mint coin is quite rare (see the OP coin).

Yes, Zutphen is extremely rare!

 

The Notre Dame colonial coinage page on these also mentions Nijmegen making them in 1692. Are these known to exist?

 

Amazing coins and discussion guys! You should start an insta page with your coins!
Now i only have the Transylvanian 1638 piece and the common 1576 Holland issue, also sold in the past a 1647 Utrecht and a 1684 Campen example. In terms of lion daalders i will probably try to get an early 1575/1576 piece and a imitation from the Italian States! By the way, does any of you have a catalogue with the late dutch silver coins? I have a 1795 Zeeland dukaat, a rare variety apparently, with a missing dot on the rev. after 'crescunt' , but i can't find a catalogue!

My 1576 daalder

 

Yes, that's Dav. 4887, another extremely rare coin. Krause does not give a value for this coin due to the high rarity. I've never seen one available in the years I've been collecting this series. Maybe I'm not looking in the right places.