Roman Empire: billon reduced centenionalis; VRBS ROMA city commemorative, ca. 330-340 AD

Discussion in 'Ancient Coins' started by lordmarcovan, Oct 19, 2020.

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How interesting/appealing do you find this coin, whether or not you're an expert? (1=worst, 10=best)

  1. 10

    7 vote(s)
    14.6%
  2. 9

    8 vote(s)
    16.7%
  3. 8

    18 vote(s)
    37.5%
  4. 7

    8 vote(s)
    16.7%
  5. 6

    3 vote(s)
    6.3%
  6. 5

    2 vote(s)
    4.2%
  7. 4

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  8. 3

    1 vote(s)
    2.1%
  9. 2

    1 vote(s)
    2.1%
  10. 1

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. cmezner

    cmezner do ut des Supporter

    Very nice follis from Siscia :) 1st Officina, I think it is an A?

    As far as I know, the two stars represent Castor and Pollux.

    Haven't picked up any city commemoratives yet.
     
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  3. dougsmit

    dougsmit Member

    I see good surfaces with less than even striking and some loss of clarity in the legend on the left. The left star is weaker than the right. The is a small flan crack of no real consequence but I am surprised NGC went 5/5 on this one. The style strikes me as ordinary from a mint not noted for 'fine style'. It is a coin I would be happy to own but would not have invested the price of a slab when compared to the value of the coin. 7
     
  4. dltsrq

    dltsrq Grumpy Old Man

    Yes, the prevailing theory at the moment is that the small bronzes from the reform of 318 down to the introduction of the FEL TEMP REPARATIO coins were called centenionalis. The word is found twice in the Codex Theodosianus but it is not entirely clear to which coin(s) the name corresponds.

    CTh 9.23.1.3, a law of Constantius II and Julian Caesar, provides that any merchant found in possession of "any coin other than that which continues in public use" shall have both the coins and his merchandise confiscated. Additionally, the law bans inter-provincial trade (speculation?) in coins per se, specifically those "commonly called" maiorina or centenionalis, along with "other moneys known to be forbidden". The Latin wording suggests that these are names in common use but not necessarily official names. Current thinking takes "maiorina" to refer to the large FEL TEMP REPARATIO coins and "centenionalis" to mean the Constantinian bronzes of 318-348. There are those who disagree, however.

    Another law, CTh 9.23.2, this time of Arcadius and Honorius, authorizes the continued use of the centenionalis while "larger coins", specifically the decargyrus, are to be withdrawn. Here, "centenionalis" almost certainly refers to the AE4 of the period.

    The two laws are separated by about 40 years.
     
    Last edited: Oct 19, 2020
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  5. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & Eccentric Moderator

    Indeed, though in this particular case, the cost of the coin to me was zero, so I thought, "why not?"

    PS- I also wanted nice professional-quality photos of the coin, given my lack of aptitude in that department. Doug Plascensia at NGC did a great job.
     
  6. ominus1

    ominus1 Well-Known Member

    ..if i did that, there'd be very few coins in my collection:smuggrin:..that's a very handsome coin melord, with lots of detail intact, every ancient collection should have at least one in it i'd reckon :) shewolf city comemorative constantine 001.JPG shewolf city comemorative constantine 002.JPG
     

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  7. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    @lordmarcovan, I rated it a 10, only because I've Never, Once seen that much fur on the she-wolf. Granted, a couple of @Alegandron's examples went a good distance.
    All I ever did with these was to get one Roma commemorative, and one Constantinopolis one, from the eponymous mints. ...Waaay too long ago to be able to find the pics, but the coins are still here. They're both solid, with olive patina. But you're stuck taking my word for it.
     
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  8. DonnaML

    DonnaML Well-Known Member

    Here's my one example of an VRBS ROMA commemorative, from the Trier Mint, First Officina (purchased from someone who found the coin by metal detecting in Wiltshire, England, in 2014). Note the unusual presentation of the wolf's fur on the reverse.

    Constantine I Vrbs Roma Obverse.jpg

    Constantine I Vrbs Roma Reverse.jpg
     
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  9. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & Eccentric Moderator

    That is in a truly remarkable state of preservation for a detector find. I mean, I realize most of the ancient coins that have come down to us today almost all had a long sojourn in the soil at some point, but whoever cleaned that one must have known what they were doing. It also must’ve been found in less-mineralized soil. Lovely find.
     
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  10. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & Eccentric Moderator

    When I was detecting over there in the UK in 2013, I avidly wanted to find a Roman coin, of course.

    In one field that had produced a Marcus Aurelius sestertius for another digger (which I mentioned recently), I found a small but thickish round disc with a green patina on it, and my adrenaline surged.

    I was certain I had just popped a late Roman Æ3!

    But it turned out to be an 18th century flat button, minus the shank. *sigh*

    I never found a Roman coin over there.

    Instead, I found one here... in Georgia, of all places.
     
  11. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & Eccentric Moderator

    @DonnaML - do you know- could your Wiltshire-dug coin have possibly been part of a buried hoard? If it was buried in a pot of some kind rather than having been a solitary find that fell directly into the ground when lost, I suppose that could have contributed to the nice preservation?
     
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  12. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    @DonnaML, may I second @lordmarcovan? For a detecting find (from the south, which is interesting even without any clue about the soil, etc.), that one is magnificent. (...Or, with scansion, 'Is (...) mag'Nificent.')
     
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  13. DonnaML

    DonnaML Well-Known Member

    The person from whom I bought the coin didn't tell me anything more specific than what I wrote -- which wasn't even part of the coin's description; he said that he found it by metal detecting in Wilshire in 2014 in response to an inquiry I sent him asking if he could give me any information about the coin's provenance. One certainly hopes that he reported his find, however large or small it was, before putting any of it up for sale.
     
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  14. lordmarcovan

    lordmarcovan Eclectic & Eccentric Moderator

    How certain are we that the beastie on the back of my coin is a wolf, anyway?

    What's the Latin for "anteater"?

    Just sayin'... ;)

    upload_2020-10-20_1-29-38.png
     
  15. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    Thanks for that. Have you tried looking on the UKDFD or Portable Antiquities Scheme websites? I've been happily surprised, a time or two, to find things that the dealer never bothered to mention were recorded in either place.
     
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  16. DonnaML

    DonnaML Well-Known Member

    Romulus and Remus were raised by an anteater? I'm not sure Rome would have had quite the same success if everyone knew that and its emblem had been an anteater, though.
     
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  17. 7Calbrey

    7Calbrey Well-Known Member

    Anteater eats ants. Ant Eater. In French, it's Fourmilier.
     
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  18. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    ...Um, this is why there needs to be an imojee for "intentional irony ...of a distinctly benign nature." (Also why I don't bother with imojees.) Checked my easy-peasy paperback Larousse; non, mon ami, ce n'est pas comme ça.
     
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  19. Roman Collector

    Roman Collector Well-Known Member

    LOL!! Unknown to the Romans because they only live in subsaharan Africa and the new world.
     
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  20. DonnaML

    DonnaML Well-Known Member

    I have a vague recollection of looking once but not finding anything.
     
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  21. +VGO.DVCKS

    +VGO.DVCKS Well-Known Member

    ...Now that you mention it, surely there'd be dozens of examples to wade through.... I really should take a look and get some idea, at least, of what you'd be facing. ...Hold me to that! It would be educational from here; never looked for much in the way of ancients.
     
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