completed (sort of) set of Carson City coins - now what?

If your interested in viewing this - there's a question about what to do with these collections at the end of the post.

Well, actually it's two sets that overlap. I recently completed both of them - took me a few years.

One set contains all 15 of the Morgans (13 years plus the common variations, capped die 1879 and spitting eagle 1891). There's also the 80/79 overdate for 1879 and three spare 78's with different VAM - none exotic. A total of 19 coins. Most are XF or better (several are BU or MS 60-61 for the years where those are more common than circulated coins -e.g., 1893. The only certified coins are the 93 (XF40) and the 89 (VF30 but might regrade XF40 with some luck). Those two are the only coins that cost more than $500 - most were much less.

The second overlapping set is one of each of the 10 types of coins minted in Carson City - including the three gold coins. Most of these are XF or better - the only exception is the twenty cent which is uncertified but probably VF30-35. The double eagle is very nice, XF or AU50 - but the most common year - 1876. The trade dollar and seated dollar are both XF but the seated dollar is probably details for being cleaned.

I won't be going for the 111 coin full set - obviously it would cost many millions and might not be obtainable at any price - I read somewhere that only two ever compiled that set.

Anyway - you're probably wondering - it all cost about $14,000 - half of which is in the five most expensive coins. Three of those higher priced coins are certified and one or two of the lower cost coins were in low end slabs and are now raw.

Here's my question: I'm not planning to sell this anytime soon - maybe ever (of course you never know) - but what advise should I leave for my wife and adult children about what to do with it - most likely how to sell it? All together? one at a time through dealers and ebay? What do you think. Currently it is all stored safely (at least I think so). Most are in a safety deposit box and all the raw coins are in airtites with tags. I also have a database that explains a little bit about what each coin is (condition, VAM, etc.) and pictures of every coin.

I hope you have enjoyed reviewing this, your suggestions would be of interest to me and very welcome.

(someday I'll photograph the whole thing)

Thanks,

Doug (fiddlehead)

 

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Good answer - I'm down with that, thanks.

 

:smile that is great bit of info :smile i guess i got my lot work to do. thank god i got all my bills of sale an such

 

I'm a little less fastidious about printing and storing my receipts for the more common, i.e., less expensive coins, But I do have them digitally. I actually enjoy keeping track of them - and all my other collections - in an excel spreadsheet. In a way that's the only way I display them since I don't like albums and I like to keep the better coins in a safety deposit box anyway. So well organized pictures (digital) and the spreadsheet is what I have. It's been great fun assembling these coins. I collected pocket knives for many years - vintage stuff in really good condition. It's always fun to assemble a comprehensive set of some kind - for example, I have a complete frame/model type set of Kabar dog's head folding knives from the 30's - it's only 9 pieces . I'm attracted to the Carson City mint coins because there's a limited number to gather and there's great history to it. I'm wary of having a collections that are so open ended that they never can be completed in any way and so there's no end to the expense - kind of like owning a Victorian house - which I also have (hard on the budget, that's for sure).

Doug

 

I could post this response in a new thread, but since the issue of taxation was brought up, how does the IRS know whether you've bought or sold a coin? For instance, if you bought a coin through an auction site, they might have your name and address on file and maybe your last 4 digits of SS for security purposes. Do auction houses send to the IRS coin data? If one bought on ebay, how many dealers (except for their own business for reporting of income tax) actually keep buyer's names on file? Are dealers at coin shops or at shows suppliers of names to the IRS of those that buy and sell coins and what coins they buy and sell? IF the answer is no, then is the paying of such tax upon the sale of coins done on the honor system? To keep this simple, let's assume transactions are not done as "cash" . . . so in the OP's collection that could be valued at over $10,000 - that the transaction or any transaction over the cash reporting limit is done by check, bank check or wired funds.

 

I would suggest you sell the set before your health deteriorates. Most heirs are overwhelmed at the emotions, the paperwork, and a million demands on their time. Disposing of a $14k value coin collection is going to not going to get much attention, nor be worth much attention for the typical coin collector. Most coin collectors are upper middle class, tend to be savers, and most have estates worth many, many multiples of 14k. Again, sell it. All the record keeping in the world only helps in maybe 10% of cases. Two business card from two trusted dealers (preferably younger than you) would be worth as much or more than all the record keeping. A fast talking dealer will sway a harried heir very easily, no matter how many records are kept.

 

That might be good advice - to sell it when one is still healthy. I have seen some cases of a grandchild selling a collection of one sort or another that was left to them - that seems like and interesting possibility - 14K, or whatever it would bring could be nice inheritance to to grand or great grandchild.

 

Then there is the issue of value. You should also keep it by retail (for insurace purposes to replace it) and wholesale (what your heirs can expect to sell it for PRIOR to deductions for selling costs). I use the Heritage Spreadsheet Program (it's free) because it provides everything Doug said, and what I mentioned, plus more. The hard part is the letter and who to trust after your gone. I have a trust fund and I have named someone as power of attorney for financial matters. This person will likely make the selling decisions on my collection latter on. He is authorized to sign into my collection at Heritage, and can view all activity when ever he wants. If I can trust him later, I can trust him now. He also helps with buying decisions. I want him to feel comfortable and be knowledgeable when he finally takes over.

 

I run several small businesses - I file three separate schedule C's - it occurs to me that if you were to declare the sale of a coin collection of modest value to the IRS, you could deduct not only the original cost of the coins, but every expense related to their purchase, storage, maintenance, etc. That would include a portion of your communication systems (phone, internet), computer purchases, software and maintenance, publications, mileage to and from the bank (if you use safety deposit box) and any expense incurred visiting dealers or going to coin shows. That could reduce your taxable net profit considerably - if there was any profit to reduce by the time you deducted the basic cost of selling.

 

Actually I'm talking about the following reporting requirements I've found on the Internet:

[TABLE="width: 375"]

[TD="width: 100"]Type
[/TD]
[TD="width: 220"]Minumum Fineness
[/TD]

Gold Bars

0.995

Any size bars totaling 1 kilogram (32.15 troy oz.) or more


Silver Bars

0.999

Any size bars totaling 1,000 troy oz. or more


Platinum Bars

0.9995

Any size bars totaling 25 troy oz. or more


Palladium Bars

0.9995

Any size bars totaling 100 troy oz. or more


1 oz. Gold Maple Leaf

as minted

25 1-oz. coins


1 oz. Gold Krugerrand

as minted

25 1-oz. coins


1 oz. Gold Mexican Onza

as minted

25 1-oz. coins


US 90% Silver Coins

as minted

Any combination of dimes, quarters, or half dollars totaling $1,000 face value or more

[/TABLE]



If an item is not on this list, sales of it does not need a Form 1099-B to be filed, no matter how large the quantity!

According to some Internet sites, the health care legislation changes the $1,000 face value reporting requirement to $600. Don't know if that's true.

My point is not to avoid taxes, but to work within the law. If there is no reporting requirement of small purchases, then no one knows anything except the possibilty that someone somewhere has a record. But within the law, there are provisions where selling to trade to equal value or higher value coins allows one to not report. This means one can potentially start out with a low value coin and over the years trade up to a coin of great value and defer paying any tax, until completely selling it. I suppose this would also mean that one could 'donate' a coin of great value without having to pay tax on it but also deduct it as a charitable gift. For instance, I bought a gold coin through the U.S. Mint as a gift for my Parent's 50th Wedding Annivesary a few years ago. I gave my parents the purchase receipt, because the reporting requirement for selling it is not on my shoulders, but one my Parents' IF they sell it. Even though the U.S. Mint has my name as the purchaser, it doesn't mean I'm the one that sold it for profit. I'm certainly not going to write the U.S. Mint the history of the one coin I purchased from them.

 

It was and the Healthcare Legislation made anything over $600 reportable, but that part of the law was later repealed.