So wait.. AU58 > Ms 60/62?

I agree with the whole AU64 idea, especially with the Morgan dollar series, imo there are many AU55-58 Morgans that are much more appealing then MS60,61 coins. Here's an example (2 coins from Heritage) 1883-S $1 AU58 PCGS. PCGS Population (332/2332). NGC Census: (490/1468). Mintage: 6,250,000. Numismedia Wsl. Price for NGC/... Morgan Dollars

1883-S $1 MS61 NGC. NGC Census: (273/1135). PCGS Population (370/1804). Mintage: 6,250,000. Numismedia Wsl. Price for NGC/P... Morgan Dollars

The difference in the two coins is about $500, Imo I would much rather have the AU58.

 

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Wow, I'm a grasshopper in a field of butterflies!

 

Better that being a grasshopper in a field of frogs.

 

Did you actually blow up those two coins - I would take the 61 over that 55. The gouges on the cheek were such a turn off to me, where as on the 62 it look more like light bag marks on the cheek. Just curious - I do agree with you that in some cases au coins out shine the low ms coins, but these did not meet that situation to me. Just my humble opinion.

 

Woops, thanks Mark I linked the wrong coin. I meant this AU58: 1883-S $1 AU58 PCGS. PCGS Population (332/2332). NGC Census: (490/1468). Mintage: 6,250,000. Numismedia Wsl. Price for NGC/... Morgan Dollars

Your right about that 55, that one was pretty rough.

 

I think what was being posited is that sometimes you can find a more pleasing example of a coin in AU-58 than you can in low-end MS grades.

remember the fact that most AU-58 coins have very few contact marks, strong luster and good eye appeal, but they also have a slight amount of wear that precludes them from being graded MS. The lower end MS coins will have strong luster but generally less eye appeal and more contact marks.

It all depends on what you prefer as to which coin you buy.

 

And you are right that Au58 coin is nicer than the 61. Loved it.

 

Check out this $10 Liberty MS-61. With BP it sold for over $200 less than NGC lists it at because of poor eye appeal. I know these are known for having heavily abraided surfaces but this is ridiculous!

http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=29103&Lot_No=24657#


While here's a MS-62 that earned it and is probably nicer than most AU-58s:
http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=1128&Lot_No=2615


And here's an AU-58 for half the price that went unsold, that I'd be just as happy to own.

http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=1121&Lot_No=10518


The AU-58 seems like a much better value, for the relative difference for the budget minded.

Here's an AU-58 from June 2004 for $270. I'd like one of these.
http://coins.ha.com/common/view_item.php?Sale_No=350&Lot_No=1139

But I shouldn't be mad that I didn't buy one then. Even though they're worth double that now in a depressed market, they're such a bad investment, I won't have to wait long for $270 again. lol

 

Mark, or anyone that can explain, want to indicate where the wear is on this coin? This looks like a beautiful AU58 but the wear is not readily apparent to me (for one thing, I don't know this series well enough to know the most likely areas of initial wear).

 

Thanks, Doug. I'm learning...

 

To me, the most obvious area is on Liberty's right leg (to viewer's left), above and to the right of the upper right hand corner of the shield.

 

All this detailed, specific, exacting points of grading is just one more reason I'm such a horrible grader in coins. I've grown up with G, F, Unc and Proof. After they started to add VF, VF and AU, I gave up. I just don't really care about the difference from AU-58 to MS anything. I look at a coin, figure out if better than what is in an Album and either use it or forget it. I know from reading all this that obviously many really, really care about those little differences and for sales and a great perfect collection those are all necessary, but I'm just to lost trying to figure out those little differences. For me this hobby is for fun and to worry about such minor differences not worth an ulcer.
I wonder when there will be the next upgrade to the grading system. A 100 point system? 1,000 point system. I'm trying to imagine an ACNCU-808.74 grade. Almost, Close to, Not Completely Uncirculated??????

 

And also some on the reverse - on the "olive branch" leg between the shield and talon, and on the "arrows" talon.

 

I agree, I think AU58 is the "sweet spot" for a lot of series.

 

I agree whole-heartedly. An AU-58 beats an MS-60 to me every time.

 

I had two 1907 $10 Indians that I had graded by PCGS. One came back as an AU-58, the other came back as an MS-61. I covered up the grades and showed the two coins to my local dealers (several dealers working in one office) and asked them to choose the more desirable coin. Almost without fail, they chose the AU-58. There is not a visible problem with that coin, it has super luster, and I would never consider selling it for an AU price unless I was really hard up for cash. The MS-61, on the other hand, was sold to someone who wanted to pay an MS-61 price for it.

 

I think you guys are nuts for making such sweeping statements.

I thought it was "buy the coin, not the holder".

Judge coins for what they are, and don't presume that a 62 is always better than a 58 -- in my experience it is hardly always the case.

 

If you are trying to build a collection with eye appeal and don't want to or can't pay some of the prices commanded by MS coins, then AU is the place to search. AU is my favorite grade. Good thread.

 

this is not buying the holder as much as it says that I'd much rather have a nice, mark-free example with a slight luster break than a coin with complete luster but lots of bag marks. Note that I originally said, (and stick to) an AU-58 over an MS-60, not a 62, not a 63, but a 60.