CoinTalk

Welcome to Coin Talk! Register Now, it's easy and FREE!

Thousands of coin collectors, numismatists, coin dealers, bullion investors, and enthusiasts make Coin Talk their number one source for numismatic news, information about US and world coins, discussions and community.

You are currently viewing Coin Talk as a guest, which limits your access to content, contests and information. By joining our free community, you will be able to join in discussions, contact other members, place free advertisements, enter contests, and much more. Registration is easy and free. Register Now


Go Back   CoinTalk > Coin Forums > Coin Chat

Notices

Coin Chat Please use this section for discussion of numismatic topics that don't fit in other sections.

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 04-17-2009, 09:19 AM   #1 (permalink)
doggone it people like me
 
900fine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,806
My Mood:
Early American Coppers convention log

Hey everybody !

This here is ya boy Ricky B reporting LIVE from the epicenter of Large Cent Happenings - the Early American Coppers convention in Cincinnatti !

I'll post up the remarkable events as they happen. Live it up !
900fine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2009, 09:33 AM   #2 (permalink)
doggone it people like me
 
900fine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,806
My Mood:
Thumbs up

9am Thursday - A seminar entitled "Counterfeit Detection and Grading" taught by two guys with a combined 60+ years experience.

The thrilling climax - the class brought coins to pass around. Every student took a shot at grading every coin. When done, we went coin by coin and compared grades to the expert's grades ! VERY cool game.

Very HUMBLING game, I should say !

Actually, I did really well overall. Of the 23 coins, I matched the experts right on 11 times. I matched 'em within one grade one grade 5 times. Great... until we got to the last coin. #23. A Draped Bust large cent.

I said "WOW ! Great detail in the hair... or most of it. A shallow depression in the cheek, but not unsightly. Strong reverse.

Sharpness is 45, a few bangs and a rim bump... I give this one 35. Great coin !"

No. NOT great coin.

That detail in the hair was TOOLED IN. No wonder parts of the hair looked so much better than other parts !

That depression in the cheek ? There had been a major gouge and some one buffed it out. It looked like Liberty was sucking on a Lemon Sour. It removed the gouge, all right. With all the subtlety of a blitzing middle linebacker.

And I just zoomed right past it. OUCH.

Humbling. But cheap tuition ! Classes here are free ! YAY !!!

Lesson learned... DON'T GET COCKY. Stay awake.

Speed grading is like speed chess. You can rip through this at lightning speed, but you'll lose valuable material. Take your time. Think it through. Then make your move.

This here ya boy Ricky B - field correspondent at EAC 2009 sayin' OVAH and OUT !
900fine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2009, 09:39 AM   #3 (permalink)
Urinist
 
HandsomeToad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 6,572
My Mood:
Quote:
Originally Posted by 900fine View Post
Hey everybody !

This here is ya boy Ricky B reporting LIVE from the epicenter of Large Cent Happenings - the Early American Coppers convention in Cincinnatti !

I'll post up the remarkable events as they happen. Live it up !
Keep it up!

I wish I could be there! Say howdy to everyone for me.

Ribbit
HandsomeToad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2009, 05:24 PM   #4 (permalink)
Numismatist
 
Leadfoot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,617
My Mood:
Wish I were there. Thanks for the log & please keep us updated!
Leadfoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2009, 05:24 PM   #5 (permalink)
Numismatist
 
Leadfoot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Posts: 5,617
My Mood:
p.s. I had a very similar experience with a whizzed coin -- IN an NGC holder.
Leadfoot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2009, 07:21 PM   #6 (permalink)
doggone it people like me
 
900fine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,806
My Mood:
1pm Thursday - Auction lot viewing !

This year's auction has ~500 lots. Last year's had ~650... 30% more than now. Here is the "big picture" :

Anything dated 1793: forget it. No 1/2c. The only chain 1c is Poor-1. Only the slightest hint of Libbie's visage, and only 4 links of the chain visible. An atrocious Wreath cent with a major planchet lamination. Looks like the back part of Libbie's skull was lost to a rocket-propelled grenade.

Half cents: Forget it. Very, very few. None interesting.

1794 Liberty Cap 1c: A staple of EAC, with more die varieties than any other date. In fact, an entire part of the club specializes in only these ! The "Boys of '94".

Well, the "Boys of '94" had little to choose from. Only 21 lots. The entire Cap 1c offering had only two to interest me.

Draped Bust : A glimmer of sunshine. A few nice ones.

Middle Dates: Plenty of nice ones - the meat of the auction.

I'm throwin' down some bids on some affordable, yet nice, Hard Times tokens.

Ricky B - ovah and out !!!

Last edited by 900fine; 04-17-2009 at 07:24 PM.
900fine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2009, 07:49 PM   #7 (permalink)
Coin Collector
 
Tater's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Utah
Posts: 1,623
My Mood:
ya, sounds like fun. keep us up to date.
__________________
Roll Searching Since July 2007
2310 rolls halves
125-40% halves
30-90% halves
Tater is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2009, 08:23 PM   #8 (permalink)
Urinist
 
HandsomeToad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 6,572
My Mood:
I know Tom Deck is there, so is Will Nipper and I haven't heard back from Jeff Rock so he should also be there. Say howdy to them for me.

Wish I was there and not here!

Ribbit

Ps: Just start going "Ribbit" and see what happens?
HandsomeToad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2009, 12:01 AM   #9 (permalink)
doggone it people like me
 
900fine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,806
My Mood:
Quote:
Originally Posted by HandsomeToad View Post
I know Tom Deck is there,
Yep.... he co-taught the Grading Seminar ! Cool dude.

Quote:
so is Will Nipper
So I hear. Haven't caught up to him yet.

Quote:
Ps: Just start going "Ribbit" and see what happens?
I tried that... they threatened to throw me out !!!!

They said either I knew H-Toad... or I WAS H-Toad !!! Either way. I had to go !
900fine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2009, 12:13 AM   #10 (permalink)
doggone it people like me
 
900fine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,806
My Mood:
7pm Thursday - The Reception !

OK... so the morning Grading Seminar had this scholarship Young Numismatist student. The kind of guy that talks for 10 seconds and you realize the dude is brilliant. For real.

The teacher said "WE GOT A KID IN HERE !!!" and he blushed red as a radish.

So I approached him and his dad at The Reception and told him "Some of us won't call you a "kid". I'll call you a Young Man !"

This, of course, ingratiated me to his dad, so they accepted my offer to join us for dinner.

Free food ! Free wine ! Free beer ! By gawd, there's gonna BE some deals now, pal !

Anyway, I chat up the YN for about 10 minutes. The youngster has memorized every die variety of all half cents and large cents... well over 350 die marriages. He is wheelin' and dealin' with the big boys... and won't won't be old enough for a driver's license for almost 3 years !

So I figure "This dude is way too smart for me. I'll chat up his dad."

Turns out his dad taught history at Brown and Johns Hopkins. Now I got TWO geniuses on my hands !

We chatted for over two hours. Awesome time.

Last edited by 900fine; 04-19-2009 at 10:24 PM.
900fine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2009, 12:38 AM   #11 (permalink)
doggone it people like me
 
900fine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,806
My Mood:
8:30pm Thursday: The Happenings !

After dinner, we all split up into four groups - Colonial guys, Half Cent guys, Large Cent guys, and Early Silver guys. We call 'em "Happenings".

I go with the Silver peeps, Robin goes with the Colonial crew.

Before the Convention, they pick certain die varieties and ask everybody to bring 'em if they got 'em. For instance, all the Large Cent guys bring their S-4 chain cents, S-10 Wreath cents, S-65 Liberty Caps, S-199 Draped Bust, and so on.

The Large Cent guys have a competition... everybody walks through and ranks all the specimens of each variety.

Tally up the points, award a winner.

But the Silver guys did it very differently.

One of the Early Silver Happenings was to take all the 1834 10c JR-6 coins and check out the differences between coins struck from the same pair of dies.

Differences ? What differences ? Excluding circulation wear, shouldn't coins struck from the same dies be the same ?

NO... because the dies themselves wear down and have die cracks and cuds.

With brand new dies, one expects sharp details. As the die wears, we see die cracks. Those cracks get worse as time goes on, ultimately forming cuds.

And here's the deal... By looking at the coins, we can see the various stages of die degradation. Some brand new dies, some very old terminal state dies.

That means we can determine the order the coins were struck ! We reconstruct the emission sequence of coins minted 175 years ago, and line 'em up - 30 or so.

In the case of 1834 10c JR-6, we see two cuds form as the die cracks worsen - both on the reverse, at 12 o'clock* and 5 o'clock**. As time goes on, both cuds worsen. The 12 o'clock widens, slowly removing letters from the word STATES until the word is almost gone

And then something very odd happens... it appears the 5 o'clock cud gets worse, but the word STATES reappears !

How can that be ?

What do you think happened ?




* where the word STATES resides
** where the arrowheads are
As expected, we see the

Last edited by 900fine; 04-18-2009 at 12:45 AM.
900fine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-18-2009, 12:23 PM   #12 (permalink)
Urinist
 
HandsomeToad's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 6,572
My Mood:
Quote:
Originally Posted by 900fine View Post
Yep.... he co-taught the Grading Seminar ! Cool dude.


So I hear. Haven't caught up to him yet.


I tried that... they threatened to throw me out !!!!

They said either I knew H-Toad... or I WAS H-Toad !!! Either way. I had to go !
Jeff Rock finally got back to me and said he didn't make it this year, he's home with the flu.

Tom Deck is one kewl dude! And he knows his coppers!

As to Will, he's hanging with the Colonial dudes so that's where you'll find him.

Lastly, how dare them throw the toad out! Tell'em I'm coming next year and to get the mops ready!!!!

Keep the reports coming, I'm enjoying them immensely!

Ribbit
HandsomeToad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2009, 04:08 AM   #13 (permalink)
AMERICAN
 
mgChevelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: SF east bay area
Posts: 747
My Mood:
Quote:
Originally Posted by HandsomeToad View Post
I know Tom Deck is there, so is Will Nipper and I haven't heard back from Jeff Rock so he should also be there. Say howdy to them for me.

Wish I was there and not here!

Ribbit

Ps: Just start going "Ribbit" and see what happens?
is this Tom Deck a real estate agent. That's one of my uncles names that I don't see very often. Probably not him.
__________________
I'll keep my guns, freedom, and money

And you can keep the Change
mgChevelle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-17-2009, 08:35 PM   #14 (permalink)
Numismatist
 
mark_h's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,187
Nice report - wish I could make it as close as I am. Sigh....
__________________
the other mark
Best Baan Community
Empty airtite seeks unwanted coins. All sizes welcome.
mark_h is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-19-2009, 01:50 AM   #15 (permalink)
doggone it people like me
 
900fine's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3,806
My Mood:
Thumbs up

Thursday night - Celebrity Party Marathon !

Well, I gotta tell ya... Thursday night, Da Boyz were in rare form.

After an amazing day, we were headed back to our hotel room when my wife Robin gets a bright idea. "Hey ! Why don't we stop by the pub for a little nightcap ?" she asks me.

Whoooo boy.

Well, we belly up to the bar. About the time they deliver me a nice cold frosty, The Boys of '94 show up. I'm not gonna drop any names, but all the Playahs were there.

I recognize one fellow - he sold his personal Large Cent collection a while back. More than $10 million.

Anyway, Robin didn't know him (an older gentleman), but she noticed his Early American Coppers name badge and says "hi". He sits down next to us and we had this wonderful chat for about 45 minutes. Very friendly and convivial. Maybe even just a little bit of silliness was going around...

Before long, we had met everyone in the place. Many big names. The guys who have entire auction catalogs named after them. The guys who write the catalogs. The book authors. The big dealers... and small dealers as well. An all-star cast !

And here's what gets me...

Let's say you like movies. Are you ever gonna rub elbows with the big stars ? No.

How about sports ? Are you ever gonna hang with the All-Pro Hall of Famers ? No.

But in numismatics, you can. Easy. You don't have to be a Playah. I'm not.

But this EAC thing is amazing. The true giants are everywhere, but you wouldn't know it by their personalities. All very friendly and approachable. They love to chat about their hobby just like you and I do.

So, no lie, there I was.... average guy like me, asking the Hall of Famers their personal strategies. How do you inspect a coin ? What do you look for ? How did you get started ? Where do you find the best stuff ? Why do dogs have black lips ? (just wanted to see if you were still reading)

Anyway, what an awesome bunch of guys. Truly a great time was had by all !

Field Correspondent Ricky B - aka ya boy Lil' Slick - ovah and OUT !!!
900fine is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks
Would you like to support CoinTalk?

Coin Talk Code of Honor
1. Post unto others as you would have them post unto you.
2. Keep it clean, like a 1950s family television show.
3. If you don't like the coin, don't trash the person.

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
George Washington Coppers (Early American) HandsomeToad US Coins Forum 15 11-04-2009 11:50 PM
Early American Coppers grading system: Help guanelid US Coins Forum 5 02-14-2009 06:54 PM
Early American Bust Coinage Speciality Site Bonedigger Open 0 03-19-2008 08:05 PM
E-Bay Silver American Eagle PCGS MS69 Lot Of 117 & A Laptop End 8/26 bigd349 Auction Listings 0 08-27-2005 03:47 PM

» Newsletter
Sign up for CoinTalk's Newsletter
enter your email address below.
» Unanswered Posts
Do You Have the Answer?
» Sponsors

» Today's Top Posters
Top Posters in Last 1 Days
[23]
[18]
[13]
[13]
[13]
[11]
[11]
[11]
[10]
[10]

All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:42 PM.


vBAdvertise v1.0.0 Copyright ©2009, PixelFX Studios
vBCredits v1.4 Copyright ©2007 - 2008, PixelFX Studios
Copyright 2008 CoinTalk
"Wiki" powered by VaultWiki v2.5.0.
Copyright © 2008 - 2009, Cracked Egg Studios.